Prepar3D in Collimated Display

[jfuenmayor]

I wonder if you have seen this video.
No crabbing .

One can only dream.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yAVIUWhTNnE

[727737Nut]

That looks nice but I have to say, after flying Scott's 5 HDTV setup, i'll take the extreme clarity and small bezels over dull projected image anyday.  I use a PJ now only because I cant afford the 5 PC's x-plane has to have. One day though I will go to HDTV surround.   Then no more flying in a dark room dark cockpit. 

Rob

[jfuenmayor]

Well, I have not tried large monitors ( TV's), so I don't know how the crabbing effect is sensed in that setup. That been said, projection does not have the fine resolution of a monitor and in collimation, the image is produced by re projecting it into a concave mirror either through a back projection screen or by using mirrors to project the image to the curved screen and then the mirror screen itself. This no doubt, produces some degradation, even in  Level D Sims!!.
The projectors must be very bright and of high resolution to compensate for this, hence expensive.
Nevertheless, the depth produced by collimation is as close as you can get to the real deal. It especially important during approach and landing.
I have had the fortune to have been on Level D simulations (latest generation, namely a Thales Airbus 330) and the visuals are nothing but impressive.
I have not seen much effort in trying to bring this into our hobby. There must be plenty of reasons for it. To me, is the lack of sufficiently wide Mylar rolls in the regular market. I think the largest is 50 or 56 inches, not sure.
Certainly, it can be built but the expertise required may be, I don't know, quiet daunting.

Cheers

[navymustang]

The significant issue with a collimated Mylar mirror system as shown in the video is the vacuum draw down system that supports the Mylar.  That includes the technique you use to mount the Mylar to the frame.
I've consulted with Q4 Services in building these displays and there is a reason this type of display cost $250,000 and upwards.  There are a few post in other simulation blogs of folks who have attempted this.  And it is a true team effort.
Long tern maintenance cost is also an issue. To re-skin a Mylar mirror cost in the $60,000 and upwards range.
Jim

[jfuenmayor]

I have seen the videos. It is a major effort.
Like I said, not for the faint of heart  .

[geneb]

Once you've done it, it's not that hard to do again.

A collimated visual is going to wipe the floor with direct projection or a pile of direct-view screens every time.

The problem with a collimated display isn't the complexity, it's the amount of space they eat up.   You can DIY a 737-sized collimated display for under $5k - just not for other people until Feb 19th, 2017.

g.

[xplanematt]

Gene, I was wondering, how is that screen working out from a maintenance perspective? Have you been using it pretty regularly without having to fiddle with it much?

Matt

[geneb]

I haven't been using it at all - it's been living at Wayne's house since 2012.  

g.

[727737Nut]

I haven't been using it at all - it's been living at Wayne's house since 2012.  

g.

Ok, sooooo how is it doing for Wayne??

[geneb]

He's not had the opportunity to use it much.  Three small, very active children tend to limit your sim time.

I do know that he's gotten the software for the controller well tuned.  A friend of mine in Colorado built a 737-sized display that I designed for him.  It regulates that mirror cell very well.  (You can nearly use a pocket-vac on it - it only takes 1-2 psi to pull down that huge mirror.)

g.

[727737Nut]

How much height do you need in a room to use this?  What happens in Aug 17   The patent issue gets resolved?  Thanks Gene

Rob

[xplanematt]

That is when GeneScreen LLC opens up, I'd imagine.

Matt

[quid246]

I too am curious to know what kind of space is needed...

I plan on starting my "sim hangar" for use with a real shell soon, so would like to take size requirements in mind in the event I go down this road in the future.

[geneb]

The "ear" patent expires on that date.  I'm still deciding whether or not to offer plan sets.

The amount of space it requires is dependent on the size of the flight deck you're using.  The 737 mirror cell rig is around 16 feet wide (ish - I can't recall exactly) and roughly 6 feet tall. The screen is around 8 feet wide by roughly 3 feet tall.

The guy I did the 737 design for actually built an addition on to his house. I've emailed him to find out what the room dimensions are.  I do know that with the mirror cell set up, he can't back away from it far enough to get the whole thing in-frame when taking pictures.

g.

[blueskydriver]

Gene,

Is this video from '10 you? The person in the video speaks about ears, and mentions Wayne, so I am wondering what happen too that collimated display?

John

[geneb]

You didn't include a link to the video.

g.

[blueskydriver]

Oops, sorry about that...here it is:

http://youtu.be/zogFny49zrI

John

[geneb]

Ok, I know what you're talking about now.

That prototype's last activity was to cook a hotdog or two and then I broke it down to salvage the materials out of it.

g.

[geneb]

Here's an update - the room size is 18x22 with a 12' ceiling.

The height works for a scratch-built flight deck that's 15" off the floor, I don't know how that height would work out for a real 737 flight deck.

g.