Hi all I'm wondering who has a genuine 737TQ out there?
I have half a model drawn up, but I'm just kinda stuck there and I missed out on an opportunity to measure up a real one =(
So here's my crazy idea.
This idea needs about 25 decent photos taken with a contrasting backdrop... sounds kinda simple... but 15 of them need to be taken in a radial pattern around the TQ. A further 5 again in a radial pattern but at a higher angle and some top photos.
Oh and the whole TQ needs to be sitting on a circular mat that has a radial pattern of dots on it.
:o
I've got a nifty little program that can read photos and generate a 3d model from them.
What I then want to do is scale my own model in Autodesk INVENTOR.
A 3d model like that could go a long way for everyone I think.
So... if some one has a genuine 737TQ, spare time and isn't bad at taking photos? ::)
I think this would be a great service to the community if you're able to get it done. I am sort of in the same position even though I don't have any real drawings per se I have constructed a mock-up of the 737TQ's support frame out of foam core board just to get a sense of the dimensions which were for the most part guesstimated. I would post a picture if I knew how to upload from my cell phone ( does anyone know how to do this?).
Even though the quality of the 737TQ from the major suppliers has risen leaps and bounds from just a couple of years ago it is still out of reach for many builders budget-wise (myself included) and therefore is still cost effective to at least attempt building one.
Ian
Quote from: simsimmer on April 20, 2010, 06:43:06 PM
Even though the quality of the 737TQ from the major suppliers has risen leaps and bounds from just a couple of years ago it is still out of reach for many builders budget-wise (myself included) and therefore is still cost effective to at least attempt building one.
Ian
Hi
I'm afraid I disagree about the real cost effectiveness! ;)
Just as an example, at 899 Euros, the unmotorized Revolution Sim TQ is not only inexpensive it is squarely underpriced for such a serious product .!!
I am not working for these guys, but I built my own TQ (check posts here) to pretty high standards and I can attest that the cost alone of raw materials, minimum amateur tooling like press drill, band saw, dremmel, sanders, heat gun, soldering tools etc, and bought parts is close if not superior to that amount, to which should be added around 180 hours of labour. Your own of course, but even at a low minimum wage it adds to more than a few thousands.
Besides, making one.. is one thing.. Making many and being able to supply/warranty.. etc.. all elements that this manufacturer, like all serious Vendors, provides generously,is another thing and makes that specific TQ an even more attractive bargain.
Building your own is fun, but think twice, 180 hours mean that it can take one full year of dedication and frustration at 4 hours per week, to end up with a nice prototype, no more.
A TQ seems like a fun and easy part to make, I can attest that it is one of the most sophisticated part to build if you want to make more than a wobbly, flimsy and unrealistically feeling device.
I built mine because I dislike the 737TQ but after all these hours I sometimes question that decision.
To sum it up: real fun YES, cost effective NO
Just 2¢ from my limited experience (lol).
Jack is right. I considered building my own (since I have plenty of tools including a cnc) but the design time alone would have taken more hours than I was willing to spend on it. The Revolution product is very underpriced in my opinion for what you get. That said, I like to tinker and build things also so I went with the Simparts TQ kit which gets you well on your way to a nice 737 TQ. Still will require a lot of hours in the end including a lot of painting, adjustments, servo and motor programming, etc. likely 50 hours worth of labor for sure.
Not taking away from you guys that want to give it a crack but just giving fair warning from experience. Jack's TQ is a work of art but it took him a lot of time and passion to get where he is on his Im sure.
Estimate how much time it will take you then probably triple your estimate. And in the end, you may want to circle back on the vendors that make them because you will get a fantastic product and backing and afterall....we all want to fly our beasties some day :-)
Good luck. Send pictures as you go so we can see how your progress is.
Scott
I can understand how much time and money could go into something like this, after all those who specialize with the product would have it down to a fine art.
The answer to a prototyping issue for me is INVENTOR.
It's not just a modeling tool but also a dynamic simulator, in other words I could give the TQ a breath of life, mechanically speaking, before I'd even begin building it.
But the hard for me now is getting the dimensions that I need to model it.
I might see if I can get down to the sim center again... :-\
Boiler plate argument Jack and point well taken Scott. I agree, the Revolution, Simparts and Opencockpits TQs are indeed great products and I support the effort by these vendors completely. BTW Jack, I didn't have to "check the post" as I am very familiar with the inspirational work by both you and Scott on this site, and so, greatly respect your collective insight.
Let me clarify by saying that the only expendable resource that I do have as a committed sim builder is time (and that is not to say that I have a lot it) and so my build philosophy is to build what I can or that is possible and nurse my budget (and that is not to say that I have one lol) to purchase items that I know I definitely can't make. On paper this cuts the projected budget for building a 737NG by a substantial amount but YES it takes longer. Thanks guys.
Ian
Honestly Craig,
Jack and Ian are truly bang on,
I have been in this hobby literally since its inception and I can tell you what ive seen of TQs leave that work up to companies that do it for a living, guys like Gwyn and Rev etc these guys have all it takes to take your TQ to levels you can be proud of. Of course building your own is fun if your iunto that, but can litterally end up 2x the cost for 1/2 the quality. also just my 2 cents.
Tim
Ditto...
sink the cash into good TQ, then expend your time and energy building everything else. After all, everything else is screens, buttons, lights and gauges... All doable by the average layman after a few hours of internet searching and asking the right questions.
TQ's....? something to look at down the road after sitting next to one flying for a while. that's when you study the innards and see how it works. That's when you build one, to say, maybe change aircraft, or make up for a shortcoming in the TQ you purchased.
When I think of building my own TQ (and I have... alot... but then I just bought the Rev-Sim one) I think of Jack and the custom made clutch. Wow. It's awesome... I never would have thought of that. I never would have thought of it because I'd still be hammering nails into plywood. ;D
Take the advice... I know of two former builders that quit because they bit off more than they could chew. They don't even fly with a joystick anymore.
Cheers!
Warren
With all that said I am possibly throwing myself in the deep end.
With my father being "the jack of all trades" I'm not in short supply of equipment, and I should soon have access to a 3axis cnc mill once a friends business has moved into their new shop, after all I am doing the drawings for their products.
From those simple points I'm thinking I might have a chance, but then again it is a process.
In fact I'm playing around with the model now trying to eye out details from some pictures.
Whether or not it gets made is to be decided in good time.
Craig
To go back to your original request, if it measurements you want, try here
http://users.skynet.be/jcordon/cockpit/plans.htm (http://users.skynet.be/jcordon/cockpit/plans.htm)
Scroll down the the bottom of the page and you will find a link to a TQ. You will need to download the free CAD viewing programme to view the plans but they are all there in segmented views complete with measurements. Better than trying to make plans from photos.
In relation to the pros and cons of making your own TQ, I have mixed feelings. I would dearly love to own an all singing and dancing TQ with buttons and flashing lights and wheels and levers that move in time to the hum of the engines but at the moment I cant, purely for financial reasons.
I agree with Jack that 899 euros buys you a brilliant bit of kit. That is if you have 899 euros. This can be and is an expensive pastime and one day I will have saved my cents to allow me to purchase the TQ. Until that time I would like to make a basic TQ which would allow me the basic functions. It would be so much better than the Saitek I use at the moment.
Warren is also right in saying that the TQ is really the hub of the cockpit and most other things can be manufactured. One day I will own a real simulated TQ !!!
Gary
Thanks Gary, I do have that drawing but it appears what I have is missing a considerable amount of info, or he has added more to it recently.
Appreciate that.
I'm somewhere in the middle on this.
I might have purchased one if one was available I could have afforded at the time, but they were either too high priced or not available. Supply is still spotty on them and prices continue to rise with everything else.
You can build your own throttle with enough time. Your time costs you nothing and that's what this hobby is about. You can spend as much or as little money as you like on a part or component. Of course, the more money and research you do, the chances are your component will be better.
I'm still waiting for that for â,¬900 727 throttle. :o
Quote from: simsimmer on April 21, 2010, 08:26:35 PM
BTW Jack, I didn't have to "check the post" as I am very familiar with the inspirational work by both you and Scott on this site,
My pleasure, sharing is the goal!
Have a good one.
JP
As we talk of 899 euro throttles, just want to remind everyone not living at the point of origin...
Shipping and Handling... not a dig on the vendors, it's a necessary evil, but when I bought my Rev-Sim TQ I had not factored in the S&H from France to the US.... Almost needed a defibrillator. In fact I later joked that I could have flown over to pick it up (and if I'd had the time, I would have just to see their setup and hang-out).
Craig, as for pics... I haven't received my TQ yet, but my understanding is that it doesn't get much more real than with the Rev-Sim TQ. I'll be more than happy to take whatever pictures you want of it when I receive it. I tend to photograph everything I own in Hi-Res so no issues there.
I'd be interested in seeing the 3D digitized product when you're done.
You can bet I'll be letting people know when I get it, so hit me up if you want any pics.
Warren
Just in case anyone need original or real 737 TQ or converted one, contact me.
also i have 3 747 TQ.
Arif
Hey guys,
I know it's an embarrassing effort for 4 months work but i'm still trying!
Been flat out!
If anyone can give me the diameters of for the speed brake, throttle and flap faces it would be appreciated!
Nice! Im getting on now with 3d modeling and I know the pains and effort required here!
;D hehe yeah, I know the feeling!
The real pain for me right now is finding the energy to do it.
After sitting at a computer drawing 8 hours a day 5 days a week it's hard to want to sit down and draw in your own time.
Kind of like when visiting a friend who's a builder and finding half finished "renovations" all over the place.
Quote from: xxilim on August 17, 2010, 06:34:17 AM
Hey guys,
I know it's an embarrassing effort for 4 months work but i'm still trying!
Been flat out!
If anyone can give me the diameters of for the speed brake, throttle and flap faces it would be appreciated!
My REVSIM Throttle will be here on the 23rd (he says at the risk of jinxing it). I will be out of town from the 24th through 27th.
I can take all the measurements and photos you need prior to installing it. Let me know what you need, if you can wait until then.
PS. I got the full up Proline with all the bells and whistles. The only thing it doesn't do is make coffee, I guess. My understanding is that it doesn't get more real than it.
Warren
hi chaps.........
just to let the 'cat out of the bag' so to speak. Eren at Revolution has decided to offer the basic
TQ in a kit form for self-assembly in an effort to reduce costs and make it affordable to a greater
audience.
he's asked me to make the build video, so i'll be getting one in the next couple of weeks. should
help bridge the gap between 'budget & skill'.... will post when i've got the kit.
have a great day.....
ian
That'll be awesome Warren.
I'll ad some more details and note what dimensions i'm after when I get a chance.
looking to start with those few surface radii under the throttle, flap and speed brake levers.... if that makes any sense? :o
Looking forward to the video Ian, sounds pretty cool.
Yes, it makes sense.
As I mentioned, I'll be out of town from Tuesday until the weekend so other than unpacking it, I won't have time to mess with until then. I'll take all sorts of pics and measurements before I drag it into the basement though.
Warren
I have one sitting next to my desk right now (revolution that is), what do you need pics and measurements of?
That looks pretty cool Craig.
Keep going - you will get there in the end.
Thanks for the info on the TQ kit Ian.
I will be very interested to see the video.
Gary
Well here's an extremely rough drawing ;D
If any one gets the chance to attack a revsim or genuine throttle with a ruler to confirm these measurements, i'll owe u big time!
I didn't get around to noting the diameter and width of the trim wheel. :-\ late night over here!
When I get a chance i'll detail the model a bit more and post it for confirmation.
I can get you those off the revo tonight, but........All I have an inch based measuring tools.
Looking good,
I dont have anything to hand but there are some sketches and stuff around if you did dig deep enough, had a go at producing one of the TQ levers ages ago, i know the throttle knob is spot on but as for the rest of it i dont know if its right ot wrong, should be close.
3D step file attached, somthing to play with
Hey inchs are as good as mm... :P
Phil, I placed your model against mine if you didn't mind, pretty big difference.
The model of my handles were decided from a combination of CAD drawings I had found a few months ago, i'll try and find the links later.
I'm curious to know if you used 3ds max to model it Phil?
Hey no probs drew it one night because i was bored, never had the chance to measure a real TQ up, pure guesswork, i use Solid edge for all my designs
Quote from: xxilim on August 19, 2010, 06:33:20 AM
Well here's an extremely rough drawing ;D
If any one gets the chance to attack a revsim or genuine throttle with a ruler to confirm these measurements, i'll owe u big time!
I didn't get around to noting the diameter and width of the trim wheel. :-\ late night over here!
When I get a chance i'll detail the model a bit more and post it for confirmation.
Posted some pictures in my gallery here http://www.737nextgensim.com/?page_id=13 (http://www.737nextgensim.com/?page_id=13) Click on the thumbs to get to the fullsize. Let me know what other shots you need.
I'm now also ready to provide you any measurements you need! Let us know!
Warren
Hey warren, just had a week end away, ill post some more drawings in the next few days.