usb DRIVERS and updates HELP!

[Mach7]

Hello all,

Quick question to anyone regarding USB driver updates. In my previous posts I have complained about engine gauge lags and freezes and think my USB speed is a direct result. I am thinking a USB driver update my increase the data speed (??)

Anyway, I am going to run "USB.DRIVERBOOST" to see if my drivers are up to date and then move forward from there.

Before I push the button on this, I am a little worried that my USB devices, plug nd play rudder pedals, goflight MCP pro, and 3 Open Cockpits DC Servor motor boards, will be greatly affected by this.....again I am not sure if this is going to cause more problems than this is worth.

So the question is will a USB driver update give me headaches, or should the devices not be affected and boot up normally once the update is complete...

thanks!

-Jim

[mickc]

I would not trust any driver update sites or software unless they are from the manufacturer.

A speed increase from a driver update would be minimal, I would look for other causes of freezing or lagging.

Do a backup or set a system restore point in Windows before you change anything just in case.

[Bob Reed]

I have to agree with mickc. I would not trust a driver update software of any kind. And for issues the first thing that comes to mind is a "re-stacking" of the USB which would change all the ids and screw up and FSUIPC programing you have done.

[Mach7]

Thanks guys.

I am going to heed your advice and not update my USB driver information. I will live with a sticky gauge or two.

Once again thanks for the information

-Jim

[blueskydriver]

What type of gauge do you have? Is it an RC servo type or other that might be going bad or needs some lubication on the gearing, if it's not the motor itself?

John

[Mach7]

Hello John,

The gauges are B747 gutted and modified with an RC servo motor(s) and operated with an Open Cockpits DC servo motor board. The gauge is fine, I have actually done some troubleshooting and changed outputs and the problem followed the other gauges.

In actuality, if I put a lot of stress on the computer, then all the gauges slow down...so it is definitely a USB data transfer rate problem. Some days its hardly noticeable and other days very noticeable.

I was only interested in the USB driver update as many internet posts say it can speed up the transfer rate by 30 percent...however I am not going to risk re jigging all my protocols in the event the driver update goes south.

I have two USB hubs coming off the Master computer. (I do not have the hubs connected to one another, but rather one computer USB output to one hub, and the other computer USB output to another).

Off of one hub I have the three SIOC open cockpits DC servo motors board outputs.

Off the second hub I have my rudder pedals, MCP, Nav 1 and Nav 2 outputs..

The main computer also displays the Captains and First Officers flight instrument panels through a video splitter. and also the outputs to a LAN hub for the wide view clients (7 separate computers).

-jim

[727737Nut]

Jim,
I can tell you that I am running 16 usb devices on my one PC and X-plane 10, no slow data at all.  I also was running opencockpits servo cards on a networked PC running 2 servo cards and 8 servos with no delays.  There is something less obvious causing a slowdown in data transfer to SIOC to servo card to servo.   

Rob

[blueskydriver]

What version type/data rate of the USB ports are on the computer versus the hubs? 1.0, 1,1, 2.0, 3.0? It's better if the hubs match the computers's USB port version...

John

[Mach7]

Thanks for the input guys,

I think you are getting close to the solution. I used to have my computer hardware information handy here at my desk, will have to dig and find it then post.

The USB hubs I am using are not the most expensive, so maybe there is a problem with the hub itself.

Anyway, will dig some more and post and hopefully solve this problem.

Rob, it is good to hear you do not have any slowdowns on your USB data...i always assumed my setup might have been òvertaxed``...would love to see what it will do if there is a simple solution to this problem.

-Jim

[blueskydriver]

Jim,

Just checking here, but do your hubs have power supplies and are they plugged in/working? If they're not powered, they then draw power from the the computers power supply through the computers USB port, so when you use more items requiring power, that might affect them. Of course that all depends on what's plugged into the hub plugs and if they're drawing power as well.

Also, there are some BIOS that have settings where you can change the USB type from 1.1+2.0 or just 2.0; this makes the USB backwards compatible for legacy hardware under 1.1. You mjight not have 1.0 or 1.1 hubs, but you never know.

Lastly, have you looked into your Device Manager lists too see if there are any yellow flag indicators before or during use of your sim? Look at the driver numbers and port info under properties of each USB item by right mouse clicking each, one at a time, and then select properties.

John

[Mach7]

Hello John,

Yes, my USB hubs are powered from there own 5 volt adapters, however the adapters are plugged into the same surge protector bus as the monitors and some other items..

I will check the BIOS settings when i get home from work along with the device manager.

I may not be able to interpret the information, so I will include a screen shot on my next post.

-Jim

[Mach7]

Here are some screen shots,

Here is a pic of my USB information, I am assuming since the directory says "enhanced" that it is indeed USB 2.0 (?).

The other two shots are probably of no use, but they are the two hubs running SIOC and the other devices....each has a separate 5 volt supply.

Can anyone make any headway with this information so far?..

Open to more suggestions,...John..I am not sure where to check the BIOS settings

-Jim

[Mach7]

Ok...to add to the information.

When I click on "[port 4] device connected" one of the SIOC USB outputs I get this information in the first pic.

As you can see it says;

bcdUSB     0x0100

and.....when I click on the usb information relating to the Bodnar interface board it says;

bcdUSB    0x0200

Is this telling me version 1 or 2.0 for the USB information?

[blueskydriver]

Just a quick observation, why aren't the red power lights lit up on the USB hubs? Are you sure you have the right power supplies plugged into their respective hubs?

More answers too follow...

[blueskydriver]

You have an 1.0 and a 2.0 hub in use; you are correct bcdUSB 0x0100 is 1.0 and bcdUSB 0x0200 is 2.0. Read this:

http://superuser.com/questions/388174/show-usb-speed-for-all-devices-in-windows-7

You need some new hubs and get both exactly the same...

John

[blueskydriver]

Your opencockpits/SIOC cards are plugged into the slower 1.0 hub and that is slowing things down. I must ask do you have an external power supply connected to your DC Motors Card, as shown in the manual, on page 4:

http://www.opencockpits.com/uploads/manuales/IOCard_USB_DcMotors_Manual_2012_REV2.0_English.pdf

If not you should have...

As for the BIOS settings, I don't think that will help, but if you have the motherboard manual and/or the motherboard model number, I can look it up.

John

[Mach7]

John,

Are you saying that the function of the SIOC outputs running on a USB 1 level are the product of the hub itself?

If so this should solve my problem if I swap out the hub (?)...and if this is the case is there a specific type of hub I should be looking for?

I was unaware that the usb hub would cause the data transfer to slow down.

Maybe I am misinterpreting your post.

And yes, I do have a separate 5 volt supply for the open cockpit boards

The hub pics were taken with no power on...thats why the rid lights are not on.

Thanks John,

I may be getting very close to solving this problem...fingers crossed

[727737Nut]

I'm pretty sure OC stuff is USB 1 or 1.1

[727737Nut]

John,
He doesn't have the USB motors card. He is using the USB Servo card.

Rob

[Mach7]

Actually guys....just ran downstairs to check...I made a mistake on my last post...

So the hub that outputs to the 3 open cockpit boards is the same hub that outputs to the Bodnar interface board (BUO836X). This means that Rob is correct in his post that OC operates off 1.0, (as the 836X shows bcdUSB x0200, and the OC boards off the same hub show bcdUSB  x0100)

So I am back to square one

[blueskydriver]

Yes, the USB # of either 1.0, 1.1, 2.0 or 3.0 stands for the data transfer rate. 1.0 is really slow dating back into the 1990's. You could have a 2.0 device like a card that rated for 2.0 plugged into a 1.0 hub, and it could work if that card is backwards compatible with the older/slower 1.0. If it is, it will run at the slower speed of the hub. If it's not, the card would not work.

So, your computer's USB ports is likely rated at 2.0 or 3.0. For your 2.0 hub they match and that is why you see Full. With the 1.0 hub, your computer switches its port speed too match the hub of 1.0, slowing it down so things can work, hence the Low value.

If you switch hubs around, you're just moving the problem onto your Bidnar Card, and it will slow things down with your rudder pedals, MCP, NAV1 and NAV2...I would not do that at all.

Do you have the motherboard model number or manual, that way we can determine your USB Ports standard or native speed. Then, you buy hubs that match that same native speed. In other words, if your computer's USB ports are 2.0, you buy 2.0 hubs.

John

[727737Nut]

I can't find your SIOC code you sent me, could you resend please. I would also like to see your sioc config  file ini     I still don't think this is a usb problem. You are just not transferring enough data for this to be an issue.  From my SIOC days, I had a pretty large file running with several cards on a USB 1.1 set-up and no lag.  Not saying there isn't a problem with yours, just that it shouldn't cause a problem.
Rob

[blueskydriver]

Looking at your pics, your Bodnar Card is connected too your 0x0200 or 2.0 Hub and the OC stuff is plugged into the 0x0100 or 1.0 hub.

Thanks Rob for pointing out he has the USBServos card...he would still need an external power sources at the card though, right? Which I think he has.

I had this problem years ago with hubs and if Jim has the time he could search for those posts under my name. It would be some good reading. I have OC USBServo Cards for my OC gauges, and those with my FDS Cards would not work with the older hub I had. I purchased some new 2.0 hubs and no more issues.

In the end, his computer USB port speeds is where it all comes down too. Some motheboards don't like legacy USB speeds and having to slow down for them. As silly as it sounds, I think it's the old saying "if you have new, stay new or if you have old, stay old". So, my suggestion is by matching hubs...

John

Edit:

A way to test the theory is switch the hubs, but that will screw up his USB assignments, like Bob said earlier. Still, if he is thinking about buying new hubs, he'll have too reassign them anyway...if it were me, I would switch them around just too see if that fixes things first; albeit, doing the reassignments would suck!

[Mach7]

John,

you wrote:

"Looking at your pics, your Bodnar Card is connected too your 0x0200 or 2.0 Hub and the OC stuff is plugged into the 0x0100 or 1.0 hub".

This is true, however the bodnar card and the OC cards are connected to the exact same hub. That was my mistake on previous post(s) that I probably eluded they were from different hubs, but they are not.

Rob, I re-sent that SIOC information to your raflyer address. I will take a pic of the SIOC_INI and post it here as well.

-Jim

[blueskydriver]

Oh, okay... I still believe it is related to USB versions/hubs.

How about this, please post the name/brand and model number of the two hubs, as well as your name/brand and motherboard model number.

John