What's with some pilots?

[matta757]

Hey all,

I just need to have a little vent... I flew to Seattle, Washington this past weekend; flying out Thursday morning and returning on the red-eye this Sunday morning. As I always do when I fly, I tried to request a visit to the cockpit at the conclusion of the flight. I have to say, I have been more successful than not in all my attempts to do this.

This trip was different. After arriving in Seattle, I REALLY didn't feel like waiting for all passengers to disembark the insanely long, single aisle 757-300 (I usually wait to be the last person off so that I don't inconvenience anyone behind me). So I got off when my row was reached. Unfortunately, we were disembarking via the second cabin door, so I didn't get anywhere close to the flight deck anyways and the door to the cockpit was still closed when I got off. Not such a big deal, I figured I'd wait until the return flight.

Come this morning, we arrived at the gate and the person I was traveling with didn't really feel like waiting again for all passengers to disembark, but since we were exiting at the forward door, I figured I'd have a better shot at it, so we got off with our row.

Walking towards the flight deck, I had my camera ready to go. I thanked the flight attendant for a great flight and politely asked if I might be able to snap a shot of the flight deck. The captain was right there in the doorway getting his bags ready, so he heard me as well. But instead of inviting me aboard, the flight attendant proceeded to tell me that I couldn't take a picture because of "security reasons". This simply pissed me off. I continued to walk off, after glancing at the pilot (who apparently said "Sorry" as we walked off, my friend heard him).

This is only the second time I have been rejected. The other time was last summer on a United 777 (I have never seen a 777 flight deck and really wanted to). When I asked if I could get a picture, the senior flight attendant JUMPED (I kid you not) in front of the cockpit door saying that "NO you can't get a picture" as if I was actually going to STORM the flight deck.

You know, I understand if pilots are tired and just want to get off the plane. I sympathize with that and hold nothing against them, if they would just say that. But instead, they feed me this bullshit line about it being a security issue. Fact of the matter is, me looking at and/or taking a picture of the cockpit is NOT going to result in that aircraft being hijacked. Maybe they're not aware of this fact, but there are PLENTY of databases with thousands of flight deck photos.

I know there are some pilots on here and I am NOT in anyway trying to offend. I would actually love to hear an actual airline pilot's opinion on this situation. Am I simply uninformed about some major concern with letting patrons visit the cockpit? And if that's the case, why do some pilots allow visits? Has anyone else had bad experiences with trying to visit the flight deck? I'd love to hear some opinions.

Regards,

Matt

[jskibo]

Might have some better luck in a skirt 

[matta757]

Might have some better luck in a skirt 

Haha good one! I know I used to have much better luck as a child. When I was 11-12 years old, back in the days of being able to go into the concourse without a boarding pass, I used to approach pilots all the time and I had the nerve to ask them to take me inside their planes... and it worked! I cannot tell you how many planes I was taken onto back in those days. Good times. Maybe I'll post some of my pics from back then...

Oh, and I realized I should probably change the name of this post from "What's with some pilots" to "What's with some flight crews?" since these two incidents were really actually flight attendants.

Regards,
Matt

[jskibo]

Yeah, back as a kid (70's...god I'm getting old), the stews used to ask if I wanted to come see the cockpit.  of course you used to get free cards and wings and such.  Those days are long gone!

Then again, I would rather have some seatback entertainment than a free deck of cards on a 9 hour flight with kids

[jackpilot]

Well Matt, Have your treat in Europe where the Captain is still N°1 Authority on the ship and paranoia is not ruling Airlines SOPs.
Cockpit visits in flight or at Take Off/Landing are still avail when properly asked for.
JP

[Maurice]

Matt, you might have had more luck with the JetBlue flight attendant who jumped off the emergency chute. His approach to customer service was exemplary 

Maurice

[xxilim]

It kind of sucks these days.

I have a friend who fly's for Qantaslink in Australia and I asked if I could check out his "office", but he says I can't go anywhere near it unless i'm employed by Qlink.

I'm not sure what security regulations you guys have but I do hold an ASIC (Aviation security identification card) and i'm allowed airside and all that stuff.

After all the security checks to get the ASIC I don't understand why I can't have a peak.

Sometimes after fueling up I like to have a look at other aircraft parked around the place, but when your being tailed by the airport security car you kind of feel like a criminal haha. This even happens at my local airport and the guy knows me, kind of annoying...

[MLeavy737]

Matt,
  Ill add my experiences with this.. First off, sounds like your biggest mistake was not bringing a kid with you I know im in a few dozen pictures with kids all over the place in the flight deck. Unless were about to go or something like that i have never heard of a flight attendant not asking us if someone can visit.

Also, i think you mentioned this already but your only chances of getting a picture on a flight is while boarding or deplaning.. Obviously no one is allowed near an open cockpit door inflight for any reason. Nor are the pilots allowed to leave for ANY reason other then to use the can.

You also have to realize a few other things that some mentioned here. One is security and the constant drilling of procedures and training into employees.  Also the consequences of airline employees not following them. Not following what seems to be a stupid procedure to the public could easily be grounds for termination in the airlines. Or at least a carpet dance explaining you actions.

Having said that i have also seen employees not exactly know what a procedure is or what may be allowed and lean toward a conservative side. pretty much EVERYTHING an airline employee does or is allowed to do is in a manual telling you exactly how to do it.

My guess with your situation is that this particular FA maybe interpreted your intentions in the wrong way. Combine that with not knowing if that was allowed or wondering if it was led her to say "Noway man!" Now if this person happened to be the lead FA you can also throw in a little "Power Trip" in there as well

Next time dont mention the taking pictures part until you get to the flightdeck and talk to the pilots..Maybe just ask if you could see it or something.. Better yet say you just started an aviation college or something.. you know what i mean.. Pilots know there are pictures of flightdecks and pretty much anything you want to know about flying all over the internet. Most flight attendants have no idea whats already out there and taking a picture of a flightdeck is something only bad guys want.

Better luck next time!

Mike Leavy

[JWS]

Well Matt, Have your treat in Europe where the Captain is still N°1 Authority on the ship and paranoia is not ruling Airlines SOPs.
Cockpit visits in flight or at Take Off/Landing are still avail when properly asked for.
JP

Well, I don't know where you got that info but getting into a flightdeck during flight, let alone during a take off or landing, is nearly impossible lately (at least that is my experience, but then again, I don't wear a skirt). Having a peek at the office usually is possible while embarking or disembarking though.

JWS 

[jackpilot]

I do not wear a skirt either and I did not get the info from anyone. Personal experience. 

[RonW]

Since the world (over here anyway) went paranoid, I use a technique that has worked almost every time (so far). I have a biz card made up to identify myself and my association with cockpit building, etc - also my company name. Ask a flight attendent to pass it along to the captain during the flight and if I could visit the cockpit after shutdown and everyone has disembarked. Sounds like a lot of effort but it works.

[warvet]

JWS maybe you should try wearing a skirt, it may reduce some of that apparent overabundance of testosterone you seem to have lol
just sayin 
Tim

Well, I don't know where you got that info but getting into a flightdeck during flight, let alone during a take off or landing, is nearly impossible lately (at least that is my experience, but then again, I don't wear a skirt). Having a peek at the office usually is possible while embarking or disembarking though.

JWS

[JWS]

JWS maybe you should try wearing a skirt, it may reduce some of that apparent overabundance of testosterone you seem to have lol
just sayin 
Tim

Maybe a kilt  I'll ask my wife about the testosterone. HAd no complaints yet. ;-)

JWS

[warvet]

Just playing with ya JWS lol a kilt may not cut it but you can try
Tim