Is anyone using the PM MCP? I am trying to set this up and so far I am batting pretty much a 0. I am using XPUIPC ver 2.0 and X Plane 10.45 and I am using the add on 737 X737. I am not able to find too much for for docs. Any help?
How much longer will you be up tonight?
John
Probably for a while I have not even tuned off the sim...
okay
After more experimenting I have a AP that is fighting with either itself or the X737 one. I have removed the plugin for the x737. What else could I be missing? m I not disabling something else?
Everything I have read about using the X737 with PM says to remove the plugin from X Plane. I have done this so what is interfering with the auto pilot? Any ideas. The plane tries to fly by what is commanded but then something changes it's mind. All axes.
So I have had a little time to play with things. I started playing with the cycle time in the MCP and that effects the instability. I will play with it some more and see if this will truly fix the issue.
Hey Bob,
I was thinking about how to help you, but since your using Xplane and X737 and I don't have those items setup, I am not sure what too tell you. Here are my thoughts:
1. If you're using PM are you using the PM MCP program or is it just the X737 portion?
2. If you change PM cycle time, where are you changing that?
3. Have you made sure that the MCP is being seen by the computer with only one COM port number and not two?
4. What MCP hardware are you using and is there an interface card?
5. How long does it take before it gets erratic after pressing command mode?
6. Is the MCP on the same computer as Xplane and if not, could it be a network issue where the two computers are losing connection?
7. Where is the CDU software located?
8. What versions of PM are using currently?
9. Does everything work normally with the same MCP and FSX?
10. Are you using PMSystems?
John
Quote from: blueskydriver on April 05, 2016, 09:30:36 AM
Hey Bob,
I was thinking about how to help you, but since your using Xplane and X737 and I don't have those items setup, I am not sure what too tell you. Here are my thoughts:
1. If you're using PM are you using the PM MCP program or is it just the X737 portion?
2. If you change PM cycle time, where are you changing that?
3. Have you made sure that the MCP is being seen by the computer with only one COM port number and not two?
4. What MCP hardware are you using and is there an interface card?
5. How long does it take before it gets erratic after pressing command mode?
6. Is the MCP on the same computer as Xplane and if not, could it be a network issue where the two computers are losing connection?
7. Where is the CDU software located?
8. What versions of PM are using currently?
9. Does everything work normally with the same MCP and FSX?
10. Are you using PMSystems?
John
Wow that is a lot of data to type! lol
So to answer your questions:
1) I am using the full PM Suit but for testing purposes this is what I have done. Tried with x737 after removing the plugin. Switched to the 172 (no AP) same exact performance. Running the PM MCP, GC And EFIS. I have run it with and without the CDU online.
2) I m changing the cycle time in the MCP ini.
3)Com port? Only thing that uses the comport is the PFC MCP and that is not important will explain more below.
4) PFC MCP serial port com3. This only talks to the PM MCP software. I can take this completely out of the loop and just run the MCP by mouse click on the GUI and I get the same actions form the AP.
5) It starts almost as soon as you engage the MCP
6) The computer is on a computer in the network.
7) CDU is on another computer but makes no difference if it is running or not.
8) Ver 512
9) Yes everything works fine in FSX last I checked which was a couple days ago.
10) PM Systems is not in the game at this time. One step at a time lol!!!
There I did it! Answered them all.. lol Now do you get any ideas?
Bob and I talked a little about this last night but I still have some lingering concerns with XPUIPC.
I wonder if there's some PM offsets that aren't mapped correctly or aren't mapped at all. XPUIPC has a facility to add offsets. Only way to check is to crack open an app that watches the original FSUIPC offset data to see if all the PM offsets are being processed.
After more experimenting although changing the cycles seems to help it is not the cure. Yet it does seem to be PM based. But what? No idea. I am stumped big time here.
Hey Bob,
I just rolled off the rack and plan too be out by the sim again tonight. I helped Angelo last night and we have a PM Part II planned for after 7pm. I will look into your issues once I get out there...
John
Quote from: blueskydriver on April 05, 2016, 01:25:46 PM
Hey Bob,
I just rolled off the rack and plan too be out by the sim again tonight. I helped Angelo last night and we have a PM Part II planned for after 7pm. I will look into your issues once I get out there...
John
I am probably going to be up pretty late tonight myself so let me know..
Okay, will do... I might even get my Xplane 10 up to the current version. Funny thing is I updated all my PM to 512 and turned all my ProSim737 (auto-start setups) off, so I could help Angelo. No complaints at all, I did it because I made him a promise last week and I wanted too honor that.
I figure since I am already half way there, I can go Xplane for a change of scenery, if I can stay awake...lol! Normally, I would be doing stuff in the hangar, but with temps back down in 20-30's at night and no heat yet, I figure just stay inside the simulator for a few days. Another reason is I think I might be overdoing it lately, having those chest pains still, last night was like the day I went too the ER... Still, you know me, I am a "DIE HARD"!
John
Hey Bob,
What a night! Angelo and I just now got off of Skype (about 5 hours total) from getting the issues he had left. It was a lot of fun just researching and going through PM things again... However, that left me here at 1AM with you likely in bed already.
I can probably get on Skype with you tomorrow night (Wednesday Night) after 8-9pm. Karen is buying the new Star Wars movie release on DVD and wants too have a movie night, so we'll be watching that from around 6pm to 8-8:30pm. Then, I can contact you afterwards.
Let me know if that will work for you,
John
Quote from: blueskydriver on April 05, 2016, 09:49:56 PM
Hey Bob,
What a night! Angelo and I just now got off of Skype (about 5 hours total) from getting the issues he had left. It was a lot of fun just researching and going through PM things again... However, that left me here at 1AM with you likely in bed already.
I can probably get on Skype with you tomorrow night (Wednesday Night) after 8-9pm. Karen is buying the new Star Wars movie release on DVD and wants too have a movie night, so we'll be watching that from around 6pm to 8-8:30pm. Then, I can contact you afterwards.
Let me know if that will work for you,
John
We will have to see how today goes. Might be a touch late for me. But one never knows...
The one thing that sticks out to me is, when I engage the AP the aircraft starts to pitch up or down. So the trim chases it so of course the longer I let it go on the worse it gets until the trim is limiting out full up and full down. You can watch it on the trim gauge. All the way up and of course the aircraft responds and then all the way down and down she goes. I can not believe I am the only one having this issue, or had. I know there are a few more folks using X Plane.
Hi Bob,
Don't forget that the 737 autopilot cannot take over with a load on the flight controls, it needs to be trimmed out first.
Not sure if PM simulates this.
Make sure you have it trimmed out first, then engage the AP.
Hey Bob,
Here is some reading for you, read each post and especially, the last entry.
http://forums.x-plane.org/index.php?/forums/topic/63827-disable-x737-autopilot-only/ (http://forums.x-plane.org/index.php?/forums/topic/63827-disable-x737-autopilot-only/)
Look at this second link back when Scott and others were using Sim-A wth Xplane (likely still are now). They found by reinstalling W7 with drivers the issues with the AP stop; however, they're using Sim-A and you're using PM. Yet, the problem sounds exactly the same for PM, as well as Scott's discovery of the CWS problem and other issues.
http://www.cockpitbuilders.com/community/index.php?topic=3867.0 (http://www.cockpitbuilders.com/community/index.php?topic=3867.0)
John
Going to start reading, but I have already investigated the CWS issue and I am not having that one. Thanks for everyones help. I really want to solve this.
I have finished the reading. Now have something else to go look at. We will see..
MCP issue is fixed. I went into the MCP looking for an adjustment someone thought was there and I did not see it so discouraged, I saw another little check box, "Dynamic Pitch F" I un-checked it and without much hope went for a ride. To my amazement it was working. So I said fluke. Shut everything down and tried it again. The auto pilot now functions as it should. ;D
Glad you got that sorted out, Bob!
Do you keep a list of these type of findings? I suffer from CRS and find that if I have to do any sort of re-install of anything later on down the line, having these notes handy saves a ton of time.
My sim has a build list. With X-Plane though, it's a very short list. :-)
Quote from: RayS on April 07, 2016, 02:53:58 PM
Glad you got that sorted out, Bob!
Do you keep a list of these type of findings? I suffer from CRS and find that if I have to do any sort of re-install of anything later on down the line, having these notes handy saves a ton of time.
My sim has a build list. With X-Plane though, it's a very short list. :-)
I need to do this! I talked to Rob today and after I said something about it, he remembered :o I would have liked to know that a few days ago! lol
One of the best parts of X-Plane is that if you can make backups of it by simply backing up the entire X-Plane Directory.
Then, if you need to re-install, spin up a new server, or go back to an old install, just copy that directory back. No need to mess with re-installing anything. (You might get asked to re-validate license info from 3rd party products, but that's about it.
No more re-installing scenery, utilities, aircraft, etc from the original binaries.
I have plenty of room on the NAS. This is a great idea.
I mis spoke. Not fixed...... Out of ideas.
Hey Bob,
I am working at getting out too the sim room... Just a few questions, and remember at this point I am not running Xplane yet, but when you run FSX and PM without the FSC MCP plugged in, does PM MCP virtual MCP work as normal?
Next, if the FSC hardware is working with PM MCP in FSX as normal, when physically connected or not, but not working when in virtual with FSU unconnected in Xplane, it makes me think that you either have offset issues or FSUIPC/XUIPC issues to WideFS. However, you say that some buttons are working, but the wrong things are happening.
Therefore, please link me to offsets you're using for XUIPC. I will look at those, as well as see how XUIPC works with Xplane10. I will look at other things as well, but may I suggest this, have you plugged and unplugged hardware, then plugged it back in while trying too solve this?
I ask because it could be that somehow the port numbers or joystick numbers are getting rearranged, and then even though you have the FSU MCP unplugged, settings or activity could be coming from something else. The only way to truly know is unplug everything, except the keyboard and mouse, then run the all PM software with the XUIPC and Xplane 10 too see if it will work normally. If it does, you start with one piece of hardware at a time, and I suggest it be the FSU MCP.
Lastly, when you thought it was working correctly on Wednesday, were you able to use it normally, with no other issues at that time? What changed it back too non-working? I will Skype with you shortly to find out more; I am asking the above questions and even though they may seem very basic to you, please don't take them wrong. I am trying to catch up to you.
John
Quote from: blueskydriver on April 10, 2016, 01:03:19 PM
Hey Bob,
I am working at getting out too the sim room... Just a few questions, and remember at this point I am not running Xplane yet, but when you run FSX and PM without the FSC MCP plugged in, does PM MCP virtual MCP work as normal?
Next, if the FSC hardware is working with PM MCP in FSX as normal, when physically connected or not, but not working when in virtual with FSU unconnected in Xplane, it makes me think that you either have offset issues or FSUIPC/XUIPC issues to WideFS. However, you say that some buttons are working, but the wrong things are happening.
Therefore, please link me to offsets you're using for XUIPC. I will look at those, as well as see how XUIPC works with Xplane10. I will look at other things as well, but may I suggest this, have you plugged and unplugged hardware, then plugged it back in while trying too solve this?
I ask because it could be that somehow the port numbers or joystick numbers are getting rearranged, and then even though you have the FSU MCP unplugged, settings or activity could be coming from something else. The only way to truly know is unplug everything, except the keyboard and mouse, then run the all PM software with the XUIPC and Xplane 10 too see if it will work normally. If it does, you start with one piece of hardware at a time, and I suggest it be the FSU MCP.
Lastly, when you thought it was working correctly on Wednesday, were you able to use it normally, with no other issues at that time? What changed it back too non-working? I will Skype with you shortly to find out more; I am asking the above questions and even though they may seem very basic to you, please don't take them wrong. I am trying to catch up to you.
John
At this point I am not using any hardware on the MCP just the PM software. So when I say push a button it is with the mouse and not a real button. I will explain more when we talk. Skype? I will need my laptop. On my way to get it. Do you have my Skype name?
Send me your Skype name please...
John
Hey Everyone,
Hopefully, Bob will post soon about his MCP issues and how the two us had a lot of fun over the telephone trying to determine what the problem was. So far, he believes we got it fixed; although, I am crossing my fingers, because we're talking PM here. Not bashing PM at all, it's just Enrico will fix things and forget to tell us how to use the changes.
For example, Dynamic Pitch F settings, which can be found by going to your virtual MCP screen, putting your mouse over the top center of the left EFIS until the word options appears, and then you click on that word to make an check box dialog window showup. There you will find the millicycle settings that go from 20-100 (50-70 is the range PM says to use). You can also find these settings in the mcp.ini file.
In the dialog window, you will also see the Bank Factor, where you set the bank factor, not bank angle limits (so don't get confused), and you'll see a Pitch Factor, which works like the Bank Factor. You use these three items to resolve the oscillations problems known to happen for some users. Next, you will see a Dynamic Pitch Factor F and under that a Dynamic Pitch High Low where you can set values for the high and low of the dynamic pitch factor F. Are you still with me?
The point is, by changing these settings you can or might get the oscillations to stop, even in Xplane as Bob is doing. You will have to pull out your "I got a lot of patience for this" hat and sit there making small changes to one item at a time, untill you get the oscillations to stop. Mind you that means you only do one change, not three or four; that means you go through the millicycle rate say by a incremental value of 5 or 10 from 20-100 to see if the problem gets resolved. If not, put the millicycle back to the default value and start incrementally changing the pitch factor (if pitch oscillations only) and bank factor (if bank oscillations only), or adjust both if you got oscillations in both factors.
If you get the bank oscillations to stop, but not the pitch, that is where you start changing the dynamic pitch F High Low values incrementally, until the problem is fixed. Oh, by the way, you must have the simulator program running and with the aircraft in the air paused, with the AP turned off, you then make a change in the above settings, and then you come back to the aircraft, unpausing the simulator program, re-engaging the AP to give it a try. That try means, let the aircraft fly a bit, engage the AP, see if the oscillations occur or not, and if they do repeat the entire process.
If the oscillations stop once you find a happy setting, don't assume it's fixed. You must fly the aircraft again, changing altitudes, changing headings, changing speeds, and then the joke of wash, rinse and repeat...lol. Seriously, if the oscillations do stop, tryout all phases of a flight using the AP/MCP, and if you dialed it in correctly leave it alone and never update PM again...uh, okay...lol...you can update, but you might be surprised as to what you get...sometimes great and sometimes not so great!
Good Luck,
John
Well.. I did not want to say anything until the sim slept over night and got woke up today. So I got home from work, went to the sim and started it all up. Well all my changes where still in place! :o Ok put the plane on runway 10 at KROC setup the MCP released the breaks and headed down the runway. N1, yup holding V1 Rotate, ok climbing. Gear up.... Clean up the plane climbing nice.. Here we go engage the autopilot.... Aircraft followed all my commands perfectly. No oscillations.... Ok lets head back towards the airport. Lets slow back down, so far so good..... flaps, gear.. Still too fast, boards... Aircraft is under 200knts (John will know what that means) Aircraft is still flying perfectly. Ok autopilot off and down for the landing.. WOW!!!!! I landed! IT WORKS!!!! John I can not thank you enough for putting up with me on the phone trying to figure this all out! Now I can continue work on the sim. LOTS to do but I am putting aplan together now that I can fly the thing.....
It took lots of messing with the timing, but I have it pretty close. It is very flyable now. I may have a few little tweaks as I go but I have now flown several flights with Lnav and Vnav so this part of the aircraft is complete. Next step, fix the yoke (Teensy) and start the structure. Now how do I get the wood all here....
So today I accidentally lost all my changes to the MCP... Now i have to start all over..... ACK!!!!!!