Hi all and a belated Happy New Year to you.
Yesterday I encountered a display problem whilst begining a flight in my default 737.
I will explain.
I run FSX with a 3 NVIDIA 9800 GT graphic card set up. Each card is connected to a seperate monitor for the outside cockpit visuals and I have at present another monitor connected to the first card for my MIP instruments.
As I started the taxi the left and right monitors started to flash and left me with just the outside scenery and no window frames of the aircraft.
The flashing got so bad, the screens and system froze. I rebooted and loaded the flight plan again and the same thing happened. I put the computer to bed for the night (not connected to the internet) and downloaded a new driver from NVIDIA from my other computer.
Today I uninstalled the old driver and installed the new one but I could only get one monitor (the top card) working. The MIP monitor is also connected to the top card and works fine. The right and left monitors connected to the lower two cards will not work.
In the NVIDIA control panel, the monitors are shown but when trying to set up multiple monitors, I can't click in the 'select' boxes of the other two monitors to activate them.
I have uninstalled the driver, downloaded it again and re-installed it but the same thing happens.
All monitors work as I have in turn disconnected the cables and connected them to the top card.
This appears to be a software issue. Why am I asking for help here and not NVIDIA ?
NVIDIA or the forums have not got back to me and I am sure you will understand that being without a plane to fly is just not on.
I am running Vista with FSX. If you need more specs then I will run up the sim computer and give them to you.
Thanks in advance.
Gary
What does Windows show for monitors and how does Windows say they are setup?
Hi Bob.
Device manager shows that I have 3 Generic PnP monitors.
Quote from: bussgarfield on January 06, 2011, 08:16:05 AM
Hi Bob.
Device manager shows that I have 3 Generic PnP monitors.
So you have 4 monitors total? If that is the case, sounds like one of the cards is bad.
Do an "identify" and see witch one does not show up.
Sorry Bob,
Just re-checked, 4 momitors, 3 generic and one non generic
Quote from: bussgarfield on January 06, 2011, 08:20:39 AM
Sorry Bob,
Just re-checked, 4 momitors, 3 generic and one non generic
Well that is a good thing... All cards present and accounted for. Try loading the default FSX flight and build a new one with your settings.
Thats the problem. I only have the two monitors on starting windows. Sorry should have made that clear.
Prior to the new driver being installed, I would have 4 monitors alight on windows opening and before loading FSX.
Gary
Hmmm Driver mess. Can you revert back to an older driver in Windows? If not you are going to have to force a compete uninstall of the Nvidia driver and start from scratch.
Thats the problem. It seemed that I was encountering problems so I completely uninstalled the old driver and installing the new one as suggested by NVIDIA which was upgraded in October last year.
The problem is Bob, it's the fact that the 'new driver software' does not allow ne to set up the multi momitor display by going into the NVIDIA control panel.
The first driver I downloaded was of 160mb. The second was 120mb so they are both different in some way but produce the same results.
I have been clicking away and scratching my head all day. I am stumped.
Gary
One of the issues is when you uninstall the driver, it does not remove everything. There is a ton of stuff left in the registry. Been a while since I had to forcefully remove a Nvidia driver maybe there is a utility to help? Someone know on here? I will look as well.
I used a utility called Driver Sweep which removes everything of the old driver from the registry so it was a complete clean install of the new driver.
You can see now why I am puzzled !!!
Well than.. That only leaves 2 other possibilities.... A screwed up install of Windows or bad hardware....
edit
Thanks John.
Just woke up (different time zone) having slept on the matter and that thought had also crossed my mind so when the good lady awakes from her slumber, I will try what you have said.
Stuck down the side of my MIP the interior will be open to all sorts of particles that fly around so it will be an excuse to un-plug everything and have a clean up.
Appreciate the advice and will let you know what happens.
Gary
Also look at the PC power supply. With all those cards you would need a beefy supply. Chances are you have an adequate size of say 800w, but maybe a faulty supply rail? As already suggested, dust and or temps inside. Download and run MSI Afterburner which can tell you the temps of your card and also manage fan speeds. Highly recommended by Nick_N over at Simforums and I've found it mandatory to keep vid cards cool.
Also try unplugging all bar one card and test, if that works add another and test, etc. Process of elimination if one card is faulty.
Good luck,
Ken.
Thanks John and Ken.
Armed with trusty shovel and broom, I set about dismantling the old beast to give it a good clean out. I was very surprised to actually see very little in the way of dust inside but it had a good clean anyway.
The PSU has ample power by the way but having marked the three GPU's, I removed them and replaced them one at a time and did a test on that card. The first two worked fine but the last one (the lower card) created beeps when the computer started to fire up and the screen remained blank.
I suspect that that card may be faulty but when I installed both the other working cards, I can still only get the top card to work within the sofware when I try to set up multiple monitors.
I have also reinstalled the old driver that came with computer when I bought it 2 years ago just in case the new drivers had a problem.
This is now getting very frustrating. I have still not received any comunication from NVIDIA. I will send them another email and see what happens.
Any further ideas or words of wisdom would be most welcome - and no, I can't afford to buy another machine just yet.
I need it up and running though for when the 737NGX is finally released !!!!!!.
Gary
Have you tried running the computer with the card you suspect bad removed?
Hi again Bob.
Yes. I initially tried them one at a time in the top PCI slot (that I new was good). On getting the beeps from the third card, I installed the two good ones leaving the third out. On firing up the computer, a message came up to tell me to change the second card from the 3rd slot to the second (ie move it down to where the third one use to be) which I did. It fired up ok but the second card and monitor does not seem to be recognised by the software.
A look in Device Manager still shows that I now have 2 GPU's and 2 Generic and one non Generic monitors.
Come to think of it, before I individually tested the cards, Device Manager still told me I had 3 GPU's and no warning triangle, so I would have thought it would have been ok.
The plot thickens although I would still like it to be software and not be a hardware problem.
Gary
I don't suppose you have another PC with similar motherboard do you?
Now I'm not going to say this is what happened to your setup but this is what happened to mine.
I was playing Dawn of war on an SLI setup PC... Screen started flashing and I had a bunch of psychedelic colours appear too. Shut down the machine and let it cool down. Turned it on... nothing.
Removed once gfx card and booted up fine... Plugged in the other card... nothing. Swapped the cards over... Huh... both cards worked in slot 1 but not slot 2.
Turned out something had happened to the motherboard and not the cards themselves.
It definitely sounds like it's hardware and not software in your case. I would suggest the thing that I do when I get a hardware problem and tracking it down becomes a puzzle... take out ALL of the cards in the PC (after logging their location) and plugging in the graphics cards one at a time in different locations. ie, take a good card and check each slot is still working correctly.
Oh, another thing, if your setup is been sucking dust for a while it might be an idea to vac out the fans on the cards and do the slots in the mobo at the same time.
I hate hardware overheat faults... one of my biggest pet hates regarding PC's.
I shall try putting what appears to be the faulty GPU in another computer today. That will hopefully establish whether it is the GPU or the mobo. The whole interior had a good clean yesterday but with no luck.
The weird thing is, when the problem arose initially, it was the right and left screens that flashed and froze with all the pretty colours. The centre screen which works from the top slot was never effected which is why I have tried the other 2 GPU's in that slot. It was the GPU from the lower slot that gave me the beeps from the 'good' slot.
Like most people I want to try and find a quick but cheap fix for this if I can as the system cost me £1500 just under 2 years ago and should have lasted a bit longer than this.
I will let you know how I get on with putting the GPU into another computer.
Many thanks all for taking the time to read this.
Gary
Oh dear... You just said the nasty words...
Quote from: bussgarfield on January 07, 2011, 11:46:22 PM
The weird thing is, when the problem arose initially, it was the right and left screens that flashed and froze with all the pretty colours.
... because that is 99.9% positive that it is the GPU that fried... As someone who has had GPU's fried in 2 PC's, 1 laptop and an Xbox 360 I can vouch for how damned annoying it is.
Strangely enough, the laptop was pronounced dead and unrepairable because of the multiple colours. Several laptop repair places said "Broke, DEAD!" and I was going to give up... went on ebay and found a replacement chip... turned out it was housed on a plugin module and all I had to do was take out the dead chip and plug in the new one and away I went... Laptop is still working to this day. The graphics cards though got chucked. My old 360 could be fixed but it was easier to buy a new 360.
Now why can't graphics card makers use the same plugin method because it would be a lot cheaper than throwing the whole darned card away.
Hi NeoMorph.
Thanks for the good/bad news. When you said you replaced the chip, I take it was on the mobo as oppsed to the GPU, if so, how did you find out that it had fried and which one. Strange thing is you see, all 3 GPU's came up in the device manager as working with no problems. I thought you normally got the yellow warning triangle if there was a problem.
I will try the 3rd GPU in this computer tomorrow as I am bushed now having just concreted a largish base for my wifes green house.
Thanks again for the info.
Gary
It's strange yet some chips continue showing nothing yet list as working while others list as not working and showing alternate bars on the screen (bright pink and black ones if I recall correctly). My 360 actually plays games but it looks like everything is in The Matrix with all these weird symbols and colours.
But every one has been proceeded by the wierd flashing colours then rebooting and then either stays that way or dies.
Running the cards in another PC will definitely show up the duff card or the motherboard. I did get one mobo go dead on a single slot and then I moved the card into the next slot along and everything was working again. I don't suppose you have another slot free on your board do you?
No, unfortunately all PCI E slots are taken up with the 3 GPU's and with the fans on top of each of them they take up quite a bit of room. Thats the price of progress I suppose.
I will try the GPU in this computer tomorrow as I said as it has a PCI E slot and load on the driver and see how I go.
If it is the mobo, then I had better start saving. How did you establish which chip had burned out by the way.
Gary
Actually having all those GPU's in a single box will definitely have caused a heat issue imho... did you ever have a thermal monitor run and get the GPU temps? They may not be over the norm too much but every degree shortens the life of the chips.
Question... did you overclock the cards at all? My guess they would be at standard speeds in a 4 card setup but some cards come overclocked already (my GTX 460 does for instance).
On the other hand it might just have been a duff chip... It happens! The one in my laptop lasted 2 weeks past the warranty of 1 year... damnit. Afterwards I found that Acer admitted they used a too powerful graphics chip for the air flow... they were replacing the graphics chip for a slower version and to compensate the user they were putting in a faster CPU... I found this out AFTER I had fixed my own laptop. >:(
I bought the computer and screens as a retirement present for myself in April 2009. Nothing has been over clocked and I have done nothing to it other than add software. The write up on it was very good in PC Pilot magazine and it was advertised as a high end gaming computer. The specs are as follows.
Intel E8500 3.19 duo core
EVGA NF780i SLI LGA775 mobo
8GB DDR2 memory
780W PSU
3 X GeForce 9800 GT 512 DDR3 GPU's
3 X Hanns-G 22" wide screen LCD monitors.
Loads more spec but these are the main items.
Worked straight out of the box and factory built. The case has 3 fans on board, one at the back and front and a large one on the open mesh side. The CPU is fan and water cooled.
I have never seen the large side fan working so would suggest that the inside temp has not got too warm - even in the height of our Spanish summers.
Gary
Either that or the side fan is faulty and not doing its job which is why the card overheated.
God, I'm such a pessimist... :(
The card is not faulty. It works ok in my other computer so - if it is not the driver then it has to be the mother board - doesn't it ????
If I have a burnt out chip as has been given a a possible cause, then presumably it must be a chip that only supplies fodder for the lower PCI E slot. Is there a way that I can determine what fault if there is one on the mobo rather than forking out for a new one.
Thanks for the continued interest in these issues.
Gary
OK, bad news time...
When the mobo has a bad slot it means that the chip that controls the PCI slots is going dodgy. My guess is that it's buggered up the power supplied to the slot but don't quote me on that. I do know when my mobo died on me (and it did eventually even after swapping the card into another slot) I just stripped out everything, replaced the mobo and then plugged everything back in (including the CPU and memory) and it worked fine.
Actually, a motherboard failure is a blessing as it's the cheapest component of the lot. It's just a damned pain to strip and build is all (and forking out the cash for it I suppose heh).
OK... that's something to think about... but lets try something else before we replace it. So we know that all the cards work in the other PC right? But when you put them into the old PC the one card doesn't work still? The gfx cards need the extra power cable don't they? Swap the power cables around so that the none working card gets another power lead (ie swap it with one from another card).
You see, it's possible that one of the power busses in the PSU has gone gaga. Ultimate test would be to swap out the PSU and test again. It could throw up a fault that would duplicate a graphics chip going gaga.
NeoMorph,
You are full of ideas. Cheers mate. I have 2 new PSU's sitting in boxes ready and waiting for the cockpit power lighting and annuciator power supply so I will try swapping the power leads around first and if the problem still arises I can fire up one of the new PSU's.
Get back to you with any results.
Cheers
Gary
Well, I am really in a tiz now.
All the GPU's work. All the power supplies are good so it is not the PSU.
I thought I would try - as a long shot - downloading a new driver from EVGA for the mobo.
I put all the GPU's back in their original slots and connected up the monitors to the original cards and fired up the beast. I got a message to tell me that the cards were in the wrong slots and windows would not open. I couldn't even load up the new driver.
Things now seem to be getting worse. I strongly suspect the mobo now and have been doing some research on a new one - £200ish - ouch.
As I am writing I am thinking of warranties so I will check with the original suppliers documentation to find out where I stand. Normally the UK companies do a 3 yr return to base warranty so I will check.
If it is still under warranty, it might mean that I have to ship the whole computer back to them which is a very heavy item I can tell you. Now I have moved to Spain, that will cost more than a new mobo.
Shall I turn to drink - not an option - already there !!!!!!!!
Gary
You can solve the slots problem by clearing the CMOS although you will have to set up your motherboard again.
Hmmmm... that's actually something I just thought of. I do remember a friend of mine who had a mobo that got into a tizz when there was a power surge. That threw some weird crap out too until we cleared the CMOS and reset it.
Try that Gary... can't hurt at least.
Oh and when I worked in a software house I always hated hardware problems... although there are funny moments too.
For example, there was this one site where half the network lost connection to the net... this was in the days where all networks were linked by coax cables (anyone remember cheapernet cables?). We tested all the hardware and it was all coming up OK... Then we come across this secretary who is moving some furniture around. What she had done was unplug her computer cables and not flicked a bypass switch on the wall port so the data hit the port and then stopped dead.
The funny bit gets when we explained to the secretary that the data was pouring out of the wall like if it was water and the room was now full of invisible data. Know what she said (and she meant it)... "But I didn't see anything coming out of the wall. Perhaps there is a blockage somewhere else and it's not reaching here!"
Then there was the time someone put an old IBM-XT on the network and it caused the rest of the network to slow to the speed of the AT. In those days the networks only worked as fast as the slowest machine on the net.
So yeah, problems like yours Gary really can turn you to drink... heh
Cheers NeoMorph.
I have put the darned thing to bed for the night now and will pick up on it tomorrow.
I will try and reset the CMOS then. Like you say, nothing to lose now really - who knows.
Fingers crossed. I have explained to the good lady how expensive certain components are to test the water which did not meet with a lot of response. Ho hum.
Will keep you updated.
Gary
I do know the power where I live has been a bit dodgy recently. We had a power cut of several hours the other day. Now I have put torches around the house just in case heh. Luckily this time I was using a LED headlight to do some soldering earlier and knew where to put my hands on it. Used a PDA to temporarily light my way.
Can you just imagine doing a flight of several hours and you are coming into land.... Fifty.... Forty... Thi...WHOOOM.... crackle... *blackout*
*facepalm*
I was in bed when the power cut hit... I have a power adjustable bed... and the back was raised so I could read. Power went out and I couldn't even lie back down to go to sleep. I think I'm gonna get a UPS for my bed now heh.
Power failures are a fact of life in my Canadian neck of the woods.
I have power packs on the PCs which beep when the juice quits and keep the computer alive for a while. Next line of defence is a 7000 watts generator.
Ahhh Global warming!!
Hi Neo.
CMOS reset, all cards back in and powered up. CMOC settings set themselves to default and ------ same thing - just the one monitor.
What I have noticed when removing the GPU's for numerous tries at sorting things out, the top two are warm to the touch (the fan casing that is) but the lowest one is stone cold.
So, would you agree that it looks like the mobo.
By the way, it is 16.30 hrs here in Spain and not a drop has passed my lips - yet.
I do appreciate all the help and words of wisdom regarding my plight - cheers Neo and others.
Gary
Yeah, sounds like you found the culprit.
"...when you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the cause of the fault."
... to misquote Sherlock heh.
Final question I think... Is the GPU fan working on the bottom card when the PC boots?
Yes all fans are working.
I can't even get windows to fire up now. I keep getting the massage 'floppy drive failed (error 40)'.
I haven't got a floppy drive and I have been into the BIOS to change the drive start up order and disabled the non existant floppy drive but it now refuses to boot up. I was at least getting one monitor working now I can't even get that.
One other thing, I have been back to the suppliers and they have informed me that I will need to stick with the 780i mobo as with 3 GPU's there are not too many other options unless I want to replace the CPU and memory.
Better get the wallet out and start seaching on Ebay.
Thanks again for all your help - much appreciated.
Gary
In the bios where there is the floppy drive there is a dialog that says Error messages... change that to "None", save and reboot. Might get it to boot up then.
But it does sound like the mobo is at fault and is finally giving up the ghost...
I went into our local computer shop in town today and in my best Spanish explained my problem. I shall be taking it in to them in the next couple of days so they can have a look.
Also seems like the 780i SLI mobo that accepts 3 PCI E X 16 GPU's is a rare commodity now days so I have asked the manufacturer to advise on a replacement in order for me to retain the CPU and memory. Heard nothing yet but I will keep you posted as to the outcome.
Gary
I was having a look too and most support dual cards but not triple. Hell, my motherboard only has one PCIe 2.0 16x slot. It has another slot listed as 16x (running at 4x) whatever that means so my plan of running SLI isn't possible either.
Hi all.
I now have a slight twist on this tale.
Having tried to source a new mobo without too much success, i bit the bullet and took the computer down to our local computer shop and in my best Spanish, exlplained my tale of woe to the repair man.
It turned out that he too was an aviation enthusiast and monitered radar and radio traffic locally. Not only that but he also installed all the fibre optics for the local military radar .... but I digress.
Long story short - All the hardware is fine and in good working order. It is not the mobo or GPU's, the CPU and memory are just dandy.
So what was the problem - Windows Vista. It had crashed big time.
He is going to reformat the HD and install Windows 7 for me. He said that he couldn't understand why MS even distibuted Vista as it was a mere stop gap whilst they completed all the tests on their main product - Windows 7.
I will find out on Tuesday when I pick the beast up and reinstall all my software and connect the 3 monitors back up again.
It would be interesting to know whether anyone else has had a Vista problem or are you all running Windows 7 ?
Gary
hello gary........
(with tongue in cheek) i have to say i agree with your computer man, vista was a major disaster. i just cannot
get on with it. but just because i don't like it doesn't mean it's as bad as i think it is ;D
do yourself a favour and get a copy of W7....... so much better and kinder to the capabilities of what your machine is capable of.
good luck mate......
ian
Ahhh DOH!
I never touched Vista as I had sooooooo many friends who did scream about how much of a nightmare it was.
Windows 7 though is a dream... I said Windows XP was awesome and I wouldn't leave it... after playing with Win7 though I have now got ONE PC running WinXP and that only because it isn't capable of running Win7 with the special hardware for my home automation. As I look at the screen for it about once every six months it doesn't really matter either heh.
That sure is good news though... I was 99% sure it was a graphics chip that had blew though after seeing so many of them go. I'm glad I was wrong.
Now my final bit of advice... Get an external drive. With a fully functional copy of Windows7 with the current MS updates onboard DO A FULL SYSTEM BACKUP sent to the external drive. Then install all you flight simulator stuff. Make sure it is all working and then make ANOTHER full backup to the external hard drive.
Now this is the most important thing. Disconnect the external hard drive and carefully put it into a fireproof safe. ;) That's what I do. I used to use Norton Ghost but for Windows 7 I use the built in version because when I tried it with Ghost I found the backups were broken... dunno if Norton have fixed it now but after the hassle I had I gave up on it, even after buying the latest and greatest Ghost that was supposedly Windows 7 compatible... and yes I did backup both partitions that Win7 creates.
Windows 7 FTW*
*(if you are not a gamer, FTW = For The Win).
Well, the situation now seems to have gone from bad to worse.
The computer 'expert' in town, told me that all the hardware was good and when I went to pick up the beast he told me that he could not install W7 as the GPU's I had installed could not cope with W7 as there were no drivers available for W7. He subsequently re-installed Vista and all the drivers.
I eagerly fired up the beast when I got home and all monitors seemed to be working - they all showed the desk top screen.
I re-installed FSX, FSUIPC, and the SIOC script for MCP, radios COM and NAV and EFIS.
I loaded up a plan for the default 737 from Schipol to Bristiol and then set about expanding to front view to my 3 monitors. Bl**dy hell, the same thing happened. The right and left monitors flashed and froze again. I was able to complete the flight on the centre monitor - zoomed out ....... but ....... I flew visual as now, FSX would not keep the designated squawk code but kept defaulting to a code of 1200.
I am totally p***ed off now.
I now plan to invite the 'expert' up to my abode (as he is also into aviation), let him have a fly on the one monitor and then ask for his 'expert' opinion. He may then realise that something is wrong.
The hard drive was wiped clean and everything installed back on so I am satisfied now that, as Neo described, this is not a software problem but lies deeper within the bowels of the hardware.
In the mean time, if anyone can throw some light on why FSX wont except the squawk code once issued and I confirm via the radio then I would be very obliged.
I can still fly on the one monitor which, incidently allows me to expand the the PFD and MFD onto a seperate monitor from the same GPU, but this is not acceptable given the previous arrangment that I had.
Sorry to harp on about this but I am now getting very desperate for a solution. If it is the hardware then I would like to pin point the problem rather that replacing the mobo, GPU's or anything else on a guessing game.
Gary
OKaaayyyyy... I'm a little bit confused here... Took me all of 10 seconds to find the Windows 7 Drivers (both 32 and 64bit) for your 9800 GT cards and even the nForce drivers for your motherboard... You sure this guy knows what he is doing?
32 bit versionhttp://www.nvidia.com/object/win7-winvista-32bit-266.58-whql-driver.html
64bit versionhttp://www.nvidia.com/object/win7-winvista-64bit-266.58-whql-driver.html
In the supported drivers list....
QuoteGeForce 9 series:
9300, 9500 GT, 9300 GE, 9800 GTX/GTX+, 9400, 9400 GT, 9800 GT, 9600 GT, 9200, 9300 GS, 9600 GS, 9500 GS, 9600 GSO, 9100, 9800 GX2
Motherboard Drivers 32 bithttp://www.nvidia.com/object/nforce_win7_32bit_15.53.html
Motherboard Drivers 64 bithttp://www.nvidia.com/object/nforce_win7_64bit_15.53.html
In the supported products list...
QuotenForce 7 series:
790i SLI, 790i Ultra SLI, 780i SLI
... so I'm kind of thinking it's the same type of expert that told me my laptop was unfixable and was just junk 4 years ago. It is now sitting in the living room working after I found the parts on ebay and fixed it myself lol. Now sometimes
The drivers are available Gary, including the SLI support ones.
QuoteSupports single GPU and NVIDIA SLI technology on DirectX 9, DirectX 10, DirectX 11, and OpenGL, including 3-way SLI, Quad SLI, and SLI support on SLI-certified Intel X58-based motherboards.
I never knew you could even go as high as quad SLI these days... Wonder what boards support it and if you need a mortgage to buy one heh.
Still sounds like a chip is borderline duff... whether it is on the card or on the motherboard I have no idea. It's still sounding like my one Xbox... runs for about 5 minutes before going crazy graphics time...
OK, I have just remembered a crazy experiment I did with my one PC.
Set up your PC as usual but leave the side panel off... Take a 12" desk fan (or two) and aim them at the guts of the PC and turn them on full. Start up your PC and see if you have the problem still. I remember one PC that would only work if it was setup like that after something went wonky.
Gary, Just to clarify the transponder code mystery:
1. You were using an FSX saved IFR flight from Schipol to Bristol?
2. Flown using "on screen" FSX ATC commands?
3. All ATC instructions were complied with [even whilst the monitors were freaking out]?
4. FSX cancelled your IFR clearance and reverted you to VFR [Sq 1200].
5. Did you get an "on screen" message cancelling your IFR clearance?
FSX is programmed to cancel your IFR clearance if you deviate from the flight planned route and you ignore remedial instructions twice. The same applies if you ignore ATC instructions, 3 strikes and you are out, well revert to VFR anyway. Just trying to see if you missed anything or if there is a system fault. I might be following you to Spain if the winters in Jolly Old carry on like this, let us know what your expert says when he sees your pit. Charlie.
Hi Neo and Hi Charlie.
Calmed down a bit now from my previous rantings.
Lots to discuss really.
Neo - I whole heartidly concur with you as I also tried a search for the W7 drivers. This 'expert', whilst a very friendly chap leaves a lot to be desired. I may firstly get a copy of W7 and go my own way with the drivers. I tried another flight today and same thing happened. The right and left screens played up but I had no problem with the centre (main) screen, so was able to fly. I moved the EICAS to the right screen and apart from the blacknesss all around it, it performed fine - so the screen and card appear to be ok - unless they are put under load - so to speak - when they flash and freeze like nobodies business. Is it a problem with FSX?. The ATC box and messages work fine when moved to the left screen - apart from the reluctance to acknowledge the issued squawk code.
Which is where you come in Charlie.
I started a new flight plan from Glasgow to Stansted. Made my flight plan using the FSX tools and guess what? - they still refused to acknowledge the squawk code
I run FSX with SP1, SP2 and Acceleration !!!!
When looking at the radio window in F10 mode, the squawk code changes briefly to the designated one and then reverts back to 1200. I can not physically change it, it still goes back to 1200.
I have re-loaded the flight and FSX but the same thing happens. I can fly by cancelling the flight plan and flying on my own but this kind of defeats the object.
I really do appreciate the long list of viewers on this subject and the offers of advice.
I will persevere and keep you updated.
Gary
When it switches back to 1200, what does the FSX transponder read?
Hi Bob.
I only use the default FSX transponder at the moment so all settings are done through FSX. Thats what is puzzling. FSX tells me the squawk code but refuses to change it's own settings once I confirm them through the radio.
My COMM radio is an Opencockpits which I can set manually and the transponder is next on the list so in the mean time I still use FSX for the transponder.
Gary
Hello Gary,
I've been following your dilemma since you started this post, but now I'm confused. I was under the impression that your left and right monitors and video cards were not working at all, but from your previous post it seems you're able to pull the EICAS and ATC box into the left and right monitors and it works fine. So that tells me that your video cards and monitors are functional. Unless I missed something?
I assume that when your system was running you were using windowed mode and pulling your views into the left and right monitors, is that correct? But now you are unable to do that without freezing or crashes?
Maybe I'm a little slow, :P but just trying to sort out what is exactly happening.
Cheers,
Rand
Quote from: bussgarfield on January 22, 2011, 08:20:34 AM
Hi Neo and Hi Charlie.
Calmed down a bit now from my previous rantings.
Lots to discuss really.
Neo - I whole heartidly concur with you as I also tried a search for the W7 drivers. This 'expert', whilst a very friendly chap leaves a lot to be desired. I may firstly get a copy of W7 and go my own way with the drivers. I tried another flight today and same thing happened. The right and left screens played up but I had no problem with the centre (main) screen, so was able to fly. I moved the EICAS to the right screen and apart from the blacknesss all around it, it performed fine - so the screen and card appear to be ok - unless they are put under load - so to speak - when they flash and freeze like nobodies business.
BINGO... It actually is your graphics chip that has blown. That is the final bit of the puzzle.Think about it... your visual (out of the window) bit is 3D... your EICAS is actually 2D... so it's the 3D rendering part of the chip that has blown which is what I have seen on a couple of graphics cards and my Xbox 360 that blew. I can actually use my 360 for anything but play the games because its the 3D part that has died on the chip and not the 2D (seperate bits apparently).
So yeah, try and find a replacement graphics card is your best bet... it's NOT the motherboard and it's NOT your OS that is at fault.
Here is a way to test my hypothesis... Take the problem card and put it into another PC. Boot it up and it will work OK... run something 3D on it and I bet you any money the thing will freak out again. As the only problem bit is the 3D on the card on that setup it will definitely show that is where the problem lies.
A quicker way to test would be to make a new outside view in a box on your main screen... outside view... move that box to the left window and I bet that box is empty as well... move it back and it will be fine. But the final test would be the above way (moving the card to the other PC).
It took you mentioning that the EICAS works on it to kick my memory into gear... 2D works... 3D doesn't. I'm sorry it took so long for my brain to kick in mate.
Neo,
Sounds logical, but I thought he was using 3 video cards, one for each monitor. So are you saying that 2 of the 3 cards blew out the 3D rendering?
Cheers
I was sure I read that he supplied left and right views from the lower card... but looks like I read it wrong.
It's really doubtful that two cards would develop the same fault at the same time...
Gary, can you please give my your full video spec (I know it's a pain) with what is connected to what graphics card. I just need the graphics wiring with what was originally connected to what card. For example you have 3 widescreen monitors... are they displaying the outside views AND the gauges as well or are there separate displays for the gauges. Each card has 2 outputs you see so I have to wonder why you have 3 cards.
We'll figure it out Gary... unfortunately fault finding via forums is a bit hard. ;) I've been guilty of assuming a bunch of stuff but you know what assuming does... makes and ass of u and me... me definitely in assuming that I read that the bottom card handled left and right views heh. Another assumption was that when you tested the cards in the other PC that you tested it for 2D and 3D. I never asked whether you did that or not. My fault for not asking you to test both.
Once I've got the correct layout in my head I'll put together a bunch of tests (which I should have done in the first place tbh) that should track down the fault. I still feel it's graphics chip related but whether it is because the PSU not giving enough amps to the cards because a power channel is dying or whether the motherboard power distribution is going gaga or whether the cards themselves have lost 3D capability I don't know yet. There are so many things that it could be.
Hold on... just thought... Are you running your rig in SLI mode or as seperate cards? I've got to admit that I don't know much about SLI you see.
Ignore that last... 3 card SLI would mean only 2 monitors supported apparently so you can't be running them in SLI mode.
Hi Guys.
I will explain how I have my monitors set and what I have displayed on which one.
Given that I have a 737 pit under construction, I have at present 3 monitors for the outside view and 3 seperate monitors in my MIP. In the MIP, only the left one (Captains side) is actually connected up so forget the other two.
At the rear of the computer case I have the connections from the 3 GPU's. Each GPU has 2 outputs. For arguments sake, No 1. GPU is at the top (the PSU end), No 2. the next one down and 3 is at the bottom.
No 1. GPU is connected to the centre monitor on the right output and the left MIP monitor is connected to the left output (when looking down from above).
No 2. GPU is connected to the right monitor from the right output.
No 3. GPU is connected to the left monitor from the right output.
When setting up a flight, I turn on the computer (it is a stand alone system - no internet) and all four monitors come alive, all showing the desktop background picture that I have - 2 pretty young ladies sitting on my police motorcycle - but I digress.
I will first activate the two sioc programmes for the Opencockpits radio COMM and the MCP. I also have the CDU, EFIS and NAV radio but they are not up and working yet as I only fly the default 737.
I will then activate FSX Booster and from there will activate FSX. The FSX window is on the centre monitor and all the other three are still just showing the desktop background.
Once I have the loaded in my flight plan I will press the 'fly now' button and get the main 737 cockpit view on the centre monitor. The other three monitors are now black - which is normal.
I will then open up another virtual cockpit window which appears in reduced form on the centre monitor. I then drag this window across to the left monitor and re-size so it fits the whole screen. I will do the same with the right monitor and then under instruments, will open up the PFD and MFD which I drag and resize to the left MIP monitor.
When all goes to plan, I have a panoramic view outside through the cockpit windows and use the PDF and MDF for navigation. I activate the ATC message window which I also drag to the left monitor so it is out of the way so to speak.
Now, virtually as soon as I drag the virtual cockpit view across to the right or left monitor, that new window will flash, the cockpit window frames disappear and return and I get different shapes and colour flashing before that window seems to freeze - this is whilst it is in it's reduced format and not re-sized.
Whilst having a flight yesterday, I could only use the centre monitor but I thought, I will try dragging the ATC message window to the left monitor as I usally do and it worked fine - but on a black screen - as I had not opened up a new cockpit view. I then thought, if the ATC window works on the left monitor, I would try the right one, so I opened up the EICAS window and dragged that to the right monitor and it too was fine.
So, Neo and Rand, it may well be the 3D chip but would both chips on seperate GPU's fry at the same time ?
I hope that this goes someway to explaining (at length) how I have my system set up and what problems I have.
As an after thought, the computer guy in town would not have put the system under load so to speak so in his mind, the system would have been up and running correctly. He only had the box so would only have been connecting one monitor to one GPU at a time.
Thanks ever so for the continued interest and help.
Kind regards
Gary
Now here is a very strange twist to the proceedings.
I have been doing a bit of experimenting given that there might be an issue with 3D.
I went into the Nvidia display software and under the 3D heading turned anything that was showing off - on. No difference but whilst in the display software I thought I would try something else.
And here is the twist - I caused the right monitor to become the primary display instead of the centre one and fired up FSX. Given now that the right monitor working through GPU 2 is the primary display I had the cockpit view with no flicker, flashing or distortion. I opened up a new virtual cockpit view and dragged that to the centre monitor (that we all thought was the 'good' one and low and behold, that one flickered, flashed and froze causing all screens to black out.
Now it would appear to me that there must be a software problem as when the right monitor is set as primary it is perfectly fine.
When I exited FSX and went back to the desktop, there was a message in the task bar which told me that the display driver had stopped responding and had recovered.
Now when I initially started having problems, I downloaded a new driver and installed it but met with the same problem. The driver I have on at the moment is from the original disc that came with the computer and was installed by the repairer after he had formatted the hard drive and re-installed Windows.
Any suggestions would be welcome.
Gary
I am willing to bet the tech installed the latest driver.. Did you check the version?
If it were me I would install the latest reference drivers from nVidia... I couldn't remember if you run Vista 32 or 64 so have included both.
32bit...
http://www.nvidia.co.uk/object/win7-winvista-32bit-266.58-whql-driver-uk.html
64bit...
http://www.nvidia.co.uk/object/win7-winvista-64bit-266.58-whql-driver-uk.html
Now if that doesn't work then I need a few more bits of info. Are the cards receiving a separate power connection from your PSU or are they powered from the motherboard? I still think that there is a possibility that there is a power problem you see. Do you have another PSU that is comparable to your existing one? I'm wondering if the system is struggling power wise and isn't giving the right juice to the GPU... Hmmmm, we need a GPU monitor...
Well after totally crashing two of my computers (typical eh ::)) I found a stable GPU monitor.... http://www.techpowerup.com/gpuz/
Download GPU-Z and it should show you the history of your cards as you use them. Have it running 3 times and select the three cards in the dropdown selector at the bottom of the board. Tick the "Continue refreshing this screen" on all three instances of the program and then switch to the sensor tab. Then run FS... Now all three should show the same values... but if the voltage drops on two of them its a possibility that it's a power issue.
God I wish I was over there... I hate doing remote problem solving because I just KNOW there has to be something causing this... I thought I had it when the 2D worked but 3D didn't... Oh well, soldier on...
Anyway, if nothing above does anything helpful, grab your replacement PSU and connect the whole thing up. Try that.
Quote from: bussgarfield on January 09, 2011, 08:15:49 AM
All the GPU's work. All the power supplies are good so it is not the PSU.
Just re-read the above... when you tested did you do 3D tests as well as 2D ones (ie did you run a 3D game or something to test the card?). You say the PSU's are good but did you run 3D for those tests as well or did you do what I thought and when you got Windows pop up you thought the GPU was OK.
It's got to be something we have overlooked... My brain is melting! :o
Gary,
Out of curiosity did you try running without FSX booster? I know when I used FSX booster it created a memory shortage that caused flashing and artifacts, then eventually crashed. Also I would start reverting back to old Nvidia drivers and work your way up to the latest. There might be an issue with running multiple monitors and your video card drivers. I run TH2GO and it does not work well with the latest Nvidia drivers. I think Ver. 182.50 is the one that works best for my system.
Personally I think it is a software issue with drivers or something and not a hardware issue. Though I've seen strange things with power supply's and motherboards.
Cheers
Hi Gary, in brief try this for the transponder problem:
1. Check that this red entry is in your FSX.cfg file:
MaxHeadOffset=0.300000
HeadMoveTimeConstant=1.000000
[VirtualCopilot]
VirtualCopilotActive=1
[USERINTERFACE]
ShowAllACPaintSchemes=1
SelectAircraftManufacturer=All
2. Unplug your Opencockpits radio stack.
3. Save a new flight in saved flights [same start as for your IFR flight plan] using the 737-800, set radios, fuel, nav data etc.
4. Create a new IFR flight plan and save with a new name.
5. Load your new IFR flight plan from Flights/Flight Planner/load button - yes to reposition, set 5555 as your squawk.
6. Request IFR clearance and after readback check that the transponder code has changed.
If you are still being hoofed back to VFR [1200], we will review the situation - you have just reinstalled FSX when the repairer
finished with his work, so there could be a duplication error methinks. Charlie.
Moderators please move this to a new thread if required.
Quote from: Emesis on January 23, 2011, 10:40:28 AM
Gary,
Out of curiosity did you try running without FSX booster? I know when I used FSX booster it created a memory shortage that caused flashing and artifacts, then eventually crashed. Also I would start reverting back to old Nvidia drivers and work your way up to the latest. There might be an issue with running multiple monitors and your video card drivers. I run TH2GO and it does not work well with the latest Nvidia drivers. I think Ver. 182.50 is the one that works best for my system.
Personally I think it is a software issue with drivers or something and not a hardware issue. Though I've seen strange things with power supply's and motherboards.
Cheers
FSX Booster sounds like a memory leak problem... I doubt that would happen right away, especially with the amount of RAM he's running. Also TH2GO verses 3x nVidia cards is a lot of difference. TH2GO is Matrox (which have always had problematical hardware I seem to remember) while the 9800 GT is a pure nVidia based chipset. As the docs say the 9800GT is specifically supported then I doubt that it would be a problem running the current drivers.
I think it's more likely to be a hardware problem because a clean install did nothing to fix it... I did computer consultancy for a number of years and you should have seen the number of really wierd hardware issues I came across so something like this is like a blast from the past. One of the reasons I got out of the support business was because some of the problems took days to nail down (intermittant faults were a bane of my existence). One of my bits of kit even tried to kill my electronics teacher when I took it in to be checked out... It fired a can capacitor that went right through the false ceiling about 3 seconds after he had moved his head out of the way to show me a meter reading that showed me that something was draining power lol... Another guy gave me a PC to check that burst into flame when I plugged it in... lucky I insisted we check the PC before I took it away or he would have sued me for setting his PC on fire (turned out to be a mains wire rubbing on the case).
So yeah... PC's can throw wobblies at you right left and centre. Doesn't help when software faults can mimic hardware faults and vice versa.
Neo,
Well the reason I'm thinking driver or memory issue is because he said this, "When I exited FSX and went back to the desktop, there was a message in the task bar which told me that the display driver had stopped responding and had recovered."
Gary have you gone into task manager and looked at your performance monitor while you're running everything?
Cheers,
Rand
Gary, to cheer you up, this is the latest homebuild with wonderful graphics to be released soon at a peanut price - enjoy, Charlie http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fm8FJ8la2VU (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fm8FJ8la2VU)
If a graphics board throws a wobbly it doesn't respond to the device driver as it expects it should it causes said device driver to hang... which then causes the error in question... so that's why it can be hardware but throw up software errors. All the device driver is the chinese whisperer between your PC's software and hardware.
If you have a corrupted device driver it can throw up that message... if you have a dead graphics card the device driver won't connect to the card (which causes the greyed out screens). Basically in that case the card won't show anything 99% of the time. The communications just cannot reach the card at all.
But if the controller part of the card is working yet part of the rendering system is failing (as in the 2D is working but the 3D is not) then the card is saying "Hey, I tried passing your message on but all I'm getting is a dial tone from the 3D guy at the moment... " which is the "the display driver has stopped working" part... So when he went back to the desktop it realises there is communication with the card again and that is the "... and had recovered" part.
I'm not being sarcastic btw... just putting it in terms most people will understand. I have a GF2MX that blew its 3D brain and yet has worked for many years in one of my home servers as a plain 2D card. Try to run anything 3D on it and it is like it's the 60's again and everyone is tripping on LSD (or in this case LCD hehe). What we need is for Greg to first try the latest reference drivers and then if that fails to put the cards into another PC and run some 3D game on it to check.
I'm not saying it isn't a software problem because it could be... I just don't think it is likely. Every time I've come across a situation where 2D works but 3D doesn't has resulted in it being a hardware issue... ever time. If the entire card is non-responsive it was around 30% hardware fault and 60% software... that extra 10% of the time it was stupid stuff like loose cards or customers plugging the monitor into the wrong port. I still remember getting called out to fix an audio problem... they hadn't even plugged in the power supply for the powered speakers and it was still in the box. I know for a fact that this isn't Gary's case because it was all working.
Edit: DOH!... I say it can't be software and then something happens to me... ???
Now there is another possibility that nudged me tonight (but I can't see it happening) but it has to be included in the "possibility" list. Ironically I had to fix my system tonight because my FSX went all nuts because Avast ran out and stopped working for some reason. It caused a bunch of stuff and then when I rebooted Win7 it refused to boot up. I had to do a system restore just to get in (even safe mode didn't work).
Now in Gary's case I suppose FSX booster could be causing a problem with his setup... I think in my case I would think of doing a vanilla install of FSX to see if it still works OK. FSX booster could be affecting the driver adversely. So yeah, humble pie time... It COULD be software if he reinstalled all the FSX addons without testing plain vanilla FSX first.
DAMNIT!... Memory like a sieve. After you run FSX and have the flashy lights and the error message about the graphics driver, did you ever think to check in the Event Manager (Control Panel > Administrative Tools > Event Viewer). It might tell you what is causing the problem if it is software. That was where I found the problem that happened to me tonight.
Oh and CeeGee... ROFLMAO
Wow CeeGee funny video, and a great message along with it! Never seen that one before.
Cheers
Neo, Rand and Charlie - hi.
So much has been written here I will have to take a step back and digest it all and today will try a few of your suggestions out and get back to you later.
Neo, I take it when you say 'do a vanilla install of FSX' you mean just do a basic firing up of the programme without FSX Booster or anything else. I did do that when I initilly installed FSX when I got the computer back home as I needed to do quick flight before installing FSUIPC. Now it is me that has the memory loss as I can't remember whether I had problems or not but I will try that first.
Charlie, thanks for the info regarding the transponder, I will also try that out later - video was brilliant by the way and it did cause a giggle even at 7.30 in the morning.
Rand, I will check the performance manager later too.
Thanks guys. The problem will get sorted one way or the other I am sure.
Gary
Yeah... Vanilla install is just what you get when you install FSX on its own... no boosters, no extra planes, no mods of any kind.
The real way to go for problem testing is to reduce everything to basic and see if it works... then add one thing at a time until the problems present usually. You aren't the first to have problems like these Gary... PC's can throw really weird faults at you all the time. Comes of being so damned modular, both software and hardware. You would have thought someone would write a diagnostics system that instantly reports any hardware or software error.
Here's something to make you laugh... Microsoft systems are so full of bugs that they think it's an error when it actually works...
(https://www.cockpitbuilders.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fmakeuseof.com%2Ftech-fun%2Fimages%2Fwindows-error-success.jpg&hash=b8e9aae8f5b690a804bac609d45c5227d3efc041)
Neo, I assumed that was what you meant so I did that. No FSX Booster and the same thing happened.
Since the installation of FSX, I have not put any additional planes, scenery or other software on.
I also had a look in the events manager afterwards but could find nothing relating to the GPU's or graphics. I have downloaded the new Nvidia driver and will put that on today and see what happens.
Previously when putting the new driver on I followed some instructions from the Nvidia forum see here -
http://forums.nvidia.com/index.php?showtopic=169555
This completely removed the old driver. I used Driver Sweeper to get enable a complete uninstall.
I will go do this again to get the new driver installed.
Watch this space.
Gary
First off, the new drivers had had no effect on the graphics at all. I still achieved the flashing and freezing on the right monitor (left monitor-see below)
I then decided to do some experimenting. I moved and switched the video cables fron one GPU to the other to see if there was any change between monitors. I found that where as I would normally get normal graphics on the centre monitor on the top GPU, I achieved the same results on the right monitor on the second GPU with the centre monitor disconnected. I had no flashing or freezing with just using the right monitor.
I haven't mentioned the left monitor as I can't get it activated since the new drivers were put on. I can put the cable into the top or second GPU and the monitor works fine however, when I plug it into the bottom GPU it comes up in the Nvidia control panel as there as it does in device manager but the activation square remains greyed out and can't be ticked.
I went into the control panel/power options and set the power from balanced to high performance. Then since loading the new driver and not having the left monitor activated, I have tried a couple of flights using the centre and right monitors. I can now fly and the cockpit window frames remain intact but on both the centre and right screens, I have blocks of clouds and multicoloured scenery from time to time.
None of the monitors work now when plugged into the bottom GPU - which was I believe suspected at the start of this thread.
So - I think I will try and get hold of another 9800GT and see how we go from there. Is it possible that one GPU will cause the other to malfuction with their displays?
O'h and Charlie. Thanks for the tip regarding the transponder. The default one works fine when not having the Opencockpit radios connected. I never had this problem before and the tansponder is not part of the sioc codes that I installed but I will uninstall then re-install and see if that makes a difference.
Had a job finding the FSX cfg by the way as there were so many hidden files and yes the details were there.
Many thanks guys. If you do have any ideas on whether one GPU will affect the role of the other two, I would appreciate your thoughts.
Cheers for all your help and taking the time to stay with me on this.
Gary
Sorry I haven't replied... been a bit poorly...
I'm really gobsmacked...
One thing... did you install the up to date motherboard drivers at the same time as you installed the new gfx driver... might be something to try.
The answer to "Can one gfx card affect the others" I have to say I have no clue but would have thought yes... I once had an audio card in a 3 audio card system die (it was for music mixing) and it affected the other two... removed that and the other two worked fine. As I have only run with a single gfx card though I have never come across it personally but have seen other people who have had 2 gfx cards and one died and DID affect the other one...
Did you try the power method btw... oh and you never answered if the cards have a separate power cable.
Hi Neo.
Hope you are feeling a bit btter now.
No I didn't install the up to date mobo drivers as I wanted to try to do one thing at a time if you see what I mean.
The GPU's all have a seperate power supply plug. This is where I came across a bit of a problem as I unpacked a new PSU (which I have waiting for the overhead power) and it is not only less powerful (700 W) but only has one PCI-E plug on it so I have not been able to change the PSU as hoped.
The current PSU is 780 W.
Tomorrow, I will install the new mobo driver and see what difference that makes. I then might swap the GPU's around again to see what happens.
Gary
You can buy Molex to GFX card power supply leads.... those would be the cheapest solution (your "expert" from the shop might sell them ;))
Before you swap the gpu's around have you tried swapping those power leads around... ie the one from the working top lead to the bottom card that is playing silly idiots?
Tried swapping the power leads round a lot earlier. Due to the configuration of the wiring harness- professionally bound and all wires neatly housed so none flap about - I can't get the top GPU power lead to reach anything but the top GPU. I will have a look at the Molex to GPU leads though.
I will have another play tomorrow.
Gary
OK mate... I'm praying that the power supply is duff... that would be a common link that would affect 2 cards you see. I think that your graphics cards might actually be OK.
I know I am swapping my ideas around but the more info I get to rule out possible faults... I feel like House diagnosing a patient from his office. ;)
"Differential diagnosis... Patient with three eyes has flashing images in two of them... GO!"
Installed the new mobo driver with no effect.
In the interim period of me buying some Molex cables, I fired up the computer with the new PSU outside the box connected in turn to each GPU power socket so they were getting the power from a different scource. Still no difference.
I still have the centre monitor and PDF monitor working fine connected to the top GPU. The other two monitors and GPU's are recognised by Device Manager and the Nvidia control panel but I can't get them activated.
I have connected the other two monitors through the top card and they work fine so it is not the monitors.
Are there any ways, or is there software that I can install, to check whether I have a problem with the hardware?
Gary
Gary,
Just curious if you ever tried an older video driver?
Rand
Rand,
I was using the original driver that came with the computer when I bought new it in April 2009.
When I started having problems, I then downloaded the latest driver which was at the time - Oct 2010.
When the computer repair man reformated, he loaded the original driver back on from the disc.
I have subsequently downloaded the very latest driver - Jan 2011 and installed that with no effect.
Gary
Unless your pc guy cut some corners on the reinstall of windows (repair instead of full reformat and install) as its still happening with original driver disk and setup config, it does look like a hardware problem. What I would do is run each of the gpu's in the first PCIE slot and run a gpu stress test for each one. That will rule out a bad card. If all pass then pick a card and run the same tests in the 2nd and third PCIE slots. If all pass in each individual slots and as you have tested with another PSU the only other thing would be on the hardware front is that your southbridge controller has died which means a new motherboard unfortunately.
It is possible seeing that your guy couldnt find W7 drivers that he didnt do a complete format and reinstall so that lingering problem is still hiding in their somewhere. You could run a program called ccleaner and run the registry cleaner. At this point it wouldnt hurt to give a try as well. After running the hardware tests and if everything worked then you should wipe the drive and do a fresh install yourself. It has worked before so you know its not a problem with vista itself. If after that it still fails to setup and work correctly then its time for a new motherboard.
For the stress test, google gpu stress test . Furmark is a good one http://www.ozone3d.net/benchmarks/fur/ but there are others well.
Gary, I meant totally swap out the existing PSU and use the molex leads for the other GPU's. It sounds like you were still using the existing PSU for the main system.
Right, might be getting somewhere now.
This morning I removed all GPU's and replaced them one by one into slot 1 and fired up FSX each time and had a quick fly. Faultless - each card worked fine. I couldn't try slots 2 & 3 as the computer wont let me unless there is a card in slot 1.
When all GPU's replaced into slots 1, 2 & 3, same problem came back.
I then did my own reformat using 'killdisk' and loaded windows back on. I put the new Nvidia drivers on and installed FSX. Tried a flight but could not get the left monitor working (GPU in slot 3).
I then took out the cable from the GPU in slot 3 and placed it in the second output on slot 2 and hey presto, all four monitors worked - left, centre, right and the MIP. Started up FSX and loaded a flight plan for the 737 and had a faultless flight from Manchester to Bristol.
It is not the 3rd GPU, that works. I will try replacing the PSU tomorrow as I have some Molex cables now and see if that makes a difference.
It is getting narrowed down now even though it has taken a while.
It is not the software.
It is not the GPU's.
May be the PSU or worse, the mobo.
Cheers again for your continued interest guys. I'll get back once I have tried out the new PSU.
Gary
Each card worked fine running a 3D program while in slot 1 (just checking that you tested 3D and not just 2D)?
Hopefully you are on the final lap now... At least you have a workaround for now.
How goes the testing Gary?
I have been away from the forum for a few days - olive trees needed pruning and land cultivating !!!!
Anyway, back to the issue in hand. I tried to install the new PSU but there are so many different connections required, I can't get it to hook up despite having the 3 Molex leads required for the GPU's.
I have still had trouble free flying on the set up as is - everything connected to the top two GPU's leaving the 3rd redundant. The 3rd card by the way was tested on it's own and 2D and 3D work fine.
It would seem that the PSU was tailor made for this computer with the connections that it does have. The main connection that I need with the new PSU but can't make is an 8 pin Molex connection to the motherboard and there is no work around that I can see.
I am going to have a look on ebay to see if I can pick one up and whilst there, have another search for a suitable mobo - if I can find one.
Cheers for the continued interest.
Gary
Hold on... I am guessing you have what looks to be a 12 pin connector on your new PSU iirc. Check the connector and see if you can remove a 4 way plug from one end (it's actually the same as a plug for the video card). It's usually just held in place by a clip at one end. I seem to remember this from my older PC as the mobo connector didn't match the PSU...
Quote from: bussgarfield on February 09, 2011, 11:56:27 PM
I have been away from the forum for a few days - olive trees needed pruning and land cultivating !!!!
Gary
As a Canadian burried in snow with temp average of minus 15 I find this offensive !! :laugh: :laugh:
Quote from: jackpilot on February 10, 2011, 05:32:00 AM
Quote from: bussgarfield on February 09, 2011, 11:56:27 PM
I have been away from the forum for a few days - olive trees needed pruning and land cultivating !!!!
Gary
As a Canadian burried in snow with temp average of minus 15 I find this offensive !! :laugh: :laugh:
Keeps your igloo from melting and shorting out you LAN
Quote from: NeoMorph on February 10, 2011, 12:26:32 AM
Hold on... I am guessing you have what looks to be a 12 pin connector on your new PSU iirc. Check the connector and see if you can remove a 4 way plug from one end (it's actually the same as a plug for the video card). It's usually just held in place by a clip at one end. I seem to remember this from my older PC as the mobo connector didn't match the PSU...
I'll be dragging my old bits out of my cupboard tomorrow (with a little help from friends) so I will let you know if I recalled correctly... I do remember that little 4 way plug being removable but I think there were more pins on that plug that 8+4.... My memory sucks.
I don't suppose you could take a photo of your mobo power socket and PSU power lead plug, could you, and post it here? Would make it easier to figure out then.