ViewGroups with Prepar3D...

[sagrada737]

I mentioned this on Jim's recent post, but I thought I would make ViewGroups a new topic for those using multiple displays.

On my 737-800 Sim, I currently use three (3) Optoma GT1080HD projectors driven from a single computer with a single GTX980ti.  I use Pixelwix AutoBlend for the warping/blending of the projected images.   For those who may not know...   Pixelwix is the OEM for FlyElise Immersive Pro, and the warping functions are exactly the same.   

In my experiments to achieve a 220 degree wrap-around display with my 12' diameter screen, I have found that the setting up of the Frustums parameters has a significanct impact on the quality of the final projected display image quality, blending, and performance in terms of frame rates.

In my case with the 220 degree screen, I am using a direct mounting of the projectors in order to clear the FDS Nose Section.   This configuration produces about a 5% overlap of the projected images.  This makes it a challenge for AutoBlend to create a perfect blending calculation, showing up as a slight blending defect from the left, center, and right projections.  Although the blend is not that perfect, the warp is very nice, making it quite usable, to the point where after a while, you don't notice it during a typical flight.

As I mentioned above, what I have found however, is that the setup of the frustums in AutoBlend (Immersive Pro) can have a profound impact of final image quality and display blending.  I am interested to know if anyone on the forum has used ViewGroups functions in Immersive Pro or Pixelwix through the asymmetric frustum settings?

The user documentation in Pixelwix (Immersive Pro) is a bit lean on setting up ViewGroups in P3D.   By contrast, P3D's documentation is highly complex and does not give adequate examples of setting up ViewGroups.   By the way...   The only way to get a ViewGroup.xml file for P3D that is produced by Pixelwix and/or Immersive Pro is to use the Asymmetric Frustum function prior to calculating the final warp/blend.  With the Asymmetric box checked, it will only produce/export the .xml file (not the .fxml for inclusion in the flight file).

In general, the importance of getting these frustum settings correct cannot be understated, because as I said, it has a big impact on image quality and blending.  When using a single graphics card, as in my case, this becomes very important.

In my experimentation with the frustum settings area, I have found that I can initially setup for asymmetric frustums and then with the Calculate function for all projectors, create a set of frustums that nicely cover the projected screen areas.   When doing so...  You will notice that the Rotation and Vert FOV values are automatically set.    However, with the Asymmetrical check box checked, it will not produce the .fxml file I want to use for my P3D flight file.   I have found a way around this, by un-checking the Asymmetrical Frustum box, then proceeding with the final single and multiple calculations, which now will produce both the .fxml file, and the ViewGroups files.

A note on the frustums when not using the Asymmetric setup...  In this case, the manual setup of the frustums, must also have all the FOV values for each projectors exactly the same.   If not, you will typically see warping and blending issues.   Not so with using the ViewGroups function, in which case, the FOV values may vary.

Anyway, I am interested in getting some detailed feedback on using ViewGroups in P3D, as I believe it will properly take advantage of the Asymmetrical Frustum setup, thereby producing the best possible display result.  I hope to hear from someone on this topic.   Thanks.

Mike

[navymustang]

Mike,
I am posting my reply to your post in the note about my circuit panels. Thought it best if people found it here.
You asked:
I noticed that your are using a projection system.   May I ask a few questions?

- How do you like the fabric screen system thus far, and how is the image detail and contrast?   
- Are you using a single computer, or multiple computers with P3D? (I assume it is P3d)
- What projectors are you using (direct or cross-over mounting) ?
- What graphics card are you using?
- What warping/blending software are you using?
- Are you using the .fxml for the flight file, or are you using P3D's ViewGroups?

So:
Image detail and contrast are "acceptable" in a darkened room, the fabric has held up on a delivered system I have in Salt Lake for almost 2 years with no issues.

I am using a master visual and 3 slave visual computers, one for each projector (yes P3D)
I am using the new Nvidia 1080 card in each PC
I am using Immersive Display Pro
And I am using the ViewGroups function, exporting the group file directly from IDP.

Jim

[Ridgenj]

Jim,

Thanks for sharing

Your are using the master as the engine without the GPU displaying any visuals and the slaves have exact copies of the SSD and render the visuals. Heavy lifting is being done by the master, wouldn't be  a GTX 1070  enough to render at the IG slaves?


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[navymustang]

oops - you are right - they are 1070s.

[Ridgenj]

Yes a powerful setup


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[sagrada737]

Hello Luis,

Are you using Immersive Pro with ViewGroups in P3D ?

Mike

[Ridgenj]

Hi Mike, Immersive Pro and you get a good deal for 4 licenses. I worked on the visuals before I put the shell


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[Flying_Fox]

Hi Mike,

I am using P3D with Asymmetric Frustum option now. My overlapping is ~10%. Looks pretty good so far, you can check the video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g4Zlc_tMFS8

and attached pictures.

(more pictures here: https://www.facebook.com/ElephantAir737/posts/708364989320750

However, it is just a result from first attempt on calibration with Immersive Calibration Pro and I am going to revise it again. I posted my export files here:
http://prosim-ar.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=72&t=9749&start=160#p78896

Nick

[sagrada737]

Hello Luis,

Working on the visuals before the nose section goes in is smart.   That is what I plan to do before I install my FDS nose section on the 6dof motion platform base.

Are you using three computers like Jim for your visuals?   
Are you using ViewGroups in P3D as well?
What version of P3D are you using, and have you installed the latest HotFix?

Mike

[sagrada737]

Hello Nick,

Thanks for your detailed post and sample ViewGroups.xml.   I have watched your video several times.   Beautiful Sim you have there, and the visuals are quite nice.   

It looks like you have a considerable overlap on the projected images, and it looks like you are using an FDS Nose Section.   Are the projectors arranged in a "cross-over" configuration to achieve the projector overlap?

Also, are you using three computers for the visuals like Jim is doing?  In my case, I am using only one computer with the graphics display setup in the Nvidia Surround mode - essentially one monitor.

Mike

[Flying_Fox]

Hi Mike,

Yes, that's right, I have FDS nose section. Recently I did the major overhaul installing new single main PC (i7-4790, 16 Gb RAM). Still using the same three Optoma GT720 projectors (left projector is actually GT750), so I have 3 x 1280 x 800 resolution. Now running off 3 DisplayPorts from single GTX980Ti  card, instead of TH2GO. No Nvidia Surround mode used. I've read on forums that Nvidia Surround mode is not recommended for Immersive Calibration Pro and  ViewGroups setup.

Projectors are set up in a straight way:

[Ridgenj]

Hi Mike, I was in contact with Jim before I bought the equipment and he shared his configuration.
I use cross projection, I am just changing my PCs to larger SSDs and testing XPlane 11.
Master PC has a GTX 1080 and the rest are exactly the same configuration just the GPUs are Strix 1070. Master PC doesn't render any visuals, so all rendering are just at the lowest position.
Initially I tried also direct beaming but the results were not satisfactory. I learned  the  hard way, so use laser levels and video cameras to do the job



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