Thinking of upgrading to Windows 10?

[RayS]

Don't.... just....... don't

I was finally pulled off the fence and enticed to upgrade my existing install from 8.1 to Win10.

That was roughly 24 hours ago.

...and I'm still battling the "Black Screen of Death" (Yes.. there are multiple flavors of the death screen.)

As of now I'm reloading Win8.1

If you have ANY sort of mild modification to your system, the biggest one being a video card, just don't... It's not worth the time or the effort.

I'm currently re-installing Win8.1 in hopes of recovering my main sim platform.

Abandon all hope, ye who enter here......

[FredK]

Have heard that from some others (non-simmers)........So I have been reluctant to enter the Valley of the Black Screen of Death for my Sim computers. 

Others I know of have not had any problems though.  So I may try it for my non-sim computer, but oddly the nagging free upgrade offer never appears on that one.....go figure!

Happy New Year!
Fred

[Bob Reed]

I am running it on an older laptop, core2 I think, and it is running fine. I know a lot of people have had driver issues with it and a lot of the companies are not writing new drivers for their older hardware. So that is an issue. Remember if you do the free upgrade you have 30 days to roll it back, providing you can get it to run......

[Trevor Hale]

I installed it on my work computer, and actually I have to say I like it.  I had one driver issue, but was able to find an updated one to fix the issue.

[Ridgenj]

Trev and Bob, are you also running your sim logic with Win10. I have it also in an older laptop and I like it. For ProSim and P3D3 I will stick with Win7 until the good news come around that is working flawlessly.

Happy New Year
Luis

[RayS]

After a bit more research I am no further along in fixing the "Black screen of death". Basically the system keeps rebooting itself.

The problem is that the Windows 10 install reverts back to the original on-board video port, rendering any video cards inop until you can get the right drivers installed.

MY problem (I have several actually but only this one will be discussed here ;-) ) is that my motherboard has an HDMI port only, which Windows 10 ALSO rendered inop.

The only way out was to do a clean install of Win8. re-install  the video drivers, re-install the screen-warping software, re-register all my X-Plane add-ons and go from there.

Thankfully X-Plane doesn't touch the registry or anything else in the OS, so it still works. (It's actually a bit faster now...) 

[KyleH]

Glad your getting it sorted Ray.

I have always wondered why people have to upgrade to the latest and "greatest" so soon without any real potential benefit.
Especially with sim's that take so much time setting up and configuring, if it ain't broke....don't fix it.

All my sim machines still run XP....

[RayS]

I have to Agree, Kyle. I was running Win8.1, and kept getting nagged to upgrade to w10. After learning that the upgrade would no longer be free in a few weeks, and having 2 other (relatively) successful systems already upgraded, I thought "What could go wrong?"

...turns out... plenty! :-)

[737man]

If it is not needed do not change a thing......

[quid246]

Windows 7.  I haven't had a program yet that has complained... so if it ain't broke, don't fix it!

[tennyson]

I was of that opinion too, but recently has dome hardware issues that took the cockpit out of service for a while.
So, I bit the bullet and upgraded all 5 computers to Win 10 and new P3D v 3.1.

I have had brilliant results. I had one issue which was a driver for a Bodnar card. The controls are also an issue within P3D V3.1, but once everything is set up with FSUIPC, it's all good.
Fly-Elise software has worked better under Win 10 as well.

So far, it has been a good move, but am still in the testing phase.

Gotta move or be left behind.



Frank

[Trevor Hale]

Trev and Bob, are you also running your sim logic with Win10. I have it also in an older laptop and I like it. For ProSim and P3D3 I will stick with Win7 until the good news come around that is working flawlessly.

Happy New Year
Luis

Hi Luis. No only my work PC my sim logic is all on XP and they do not allow the upgrade from xp

Trev

[jackpilot]

All on XP , silky smooth and no issue whatsoever

Chasing the end of the  rainbow is what they expect you to do...why do it

[KyleH]

One thing I have read about win10 is that if you disable automatic updates (and re-starts) so you can do them manually, the next update will turn them back on. Not something desirable on a sim machine.

[HarryZ]

I loaded Win  10 on my business machine and it went flawlessly. The install loaded all the new drivers automatically and so far no issues.

But I really don't like the Windows Update set-up.  The last one has caused some real issues with some programs (my Incredimail mail reader) and made in inoperative! I had to go and remove that update in order to get it working again.  Read that other programs as well have had problems.

I would not recommend Win 10 with your sim at this time. Far too many unknowns.

[Live2Fly]

I agree Harry.  Windows 10 is far too new to be used in a flight sim, especially with the amount of time and effort some of us have put into their sims.  Although the upgrade might work, do you want to be that one person who has issues?

I would try and wait as long as I could before upgrading, Microsoft will be releasing Win10 updates, just like they did with Win8 almost immediately after it was released.

Unfortunately it looks like MS will make the free Windows10 upgrade a mandatory update, rather than optional which is why some of you have gotten the nag screen asking if you want to update.

[jackpilot]

"Mandatory"
Why ?
There is a point at which a sim works fine and offers probably more sophistication than one can handle unless you are a professional pilot or  want the very latest iteration of Boeing technology. Most of us use far less features  than what the simulated beast can deliver.
The idea is flying it, perfecting your (virtual or real) pilot skills and enjoying it.
Spending money, time and energy updating, reinstalling, re-initializing, correcting, searching, solving or not new issues is not my vision of a flight simulator.
Our PC sims are mostly distinct from  the "home or office" computer and do not have to be bombarded with all kinds of updates.
Same is valid for Avionics softs X.XX new versions. forums are 80% full of questions about failures after the latest XX has been installed.
Maybe old age is kiking in but this is IMHO.
Of course, Just my 2¢ Guys...
Besides, I will fire the sim shortly and practice my landings westwards  in Juneau (Alaska) ...better than Innsbruck!   

[jfuenmayor]

Hi Gents.

As I understand it, Win 10 comes in two versions, one for the enterprise ( not available to the general public ) and a version for common mortals, and some say packed with sniffware, and the well known DRM code; not to mention the fact that some firmly believe that MS is on a path to a subscription service. This has not yet been confirmed by MS, but all of the above are disturbing.

Windows 7 is the best OS that MS has offered to date, en par with XP in its prime time. It is stable, no memory leaks and with plenty of drivers.

The big Level D Simulators work under UNIX, a plataform with minor upgrades since Version V and rock solid. All the flavors of UNIX ( BSD, AIX, SOLARIS, Mac OS etc. ) are its derivatives.

With this in mind, the problem is the future, which Of course is uncertain. Alternative plataforms such as Linux ( Mint or Ubuntu ) or MacOS could be considered. X Plane is available for Linux and MacOS. I doubt Prepar 3D will ever be, and by the same token almost all addon software, including ProSim which depends on the .NET framework. Linux has its on .NET stack called MONO, which I don't know how well interacts with the MS one. Porting the Software from MS to UNIX-Linux is a significant task and can only be ascertained by the programmer.
So we are stuck.
I have my updates tuned off just in case.

Cheers.

[Live2Fly]

"Mandatory"
Why ?
There is a point at which a sim works fine and offers probably more sophistication than one can handle unless you are a professional pilot or  want the very latest iteration of Boeing technology. Most of us use far less features  than what the simulated beast can deliver.
The idea is flying it, perfecting your (virtual or real) pilot skills and enjoying it.
Spending money, time and energy updating, reinstalling, re-initializing, correcting, searching, solving or not new issues is not my vision of a flight simulator.
Our PC sims are mostly distinct from  the "home or office" computer and do not have to be bombarded with all kinds of updates.
Same is valid for Avionics softs X.XX new versions. forums are 80% full of questions about failures after the latest XX has been installed.
Maybe old age is kiking in but this is IMHO.
Of course, Just my 2¢ Guys...
Besides, I will fire the sim shortly and practice my landings westwards  in Juneau (Alaska) ...better than Innsbruck!   

Hi Jack, take a look at this pcworld article, it's from back in October but I've heard reports that this is still happening as recent as at least 2 weeks ago.  Maybe MS will cave and allow users to opt out of the upgrade.

http://www.pcworld.com/article/2993381/windows/windows-10-upgrades-reportedly-appearing-as-mandatory-for-some-users.html

[tennyson]

Dear, dear, some doom and gloom here.

Having been in the IT industry in a previous life, I have heard this all before.

Win 10 is not the big boogey man that some are making out and apart from a controller issue with one Bodnar card, I've had no issues.

If the worry is about updates, then do not connect to the net. Pretty simple.
If you own a sim, your PC's from the sim probably shouldn't be connected to the net anyway.

It is just an operating system, a damn efficient one, so why would you not want to stay current and be efficient.
There seems to be a general trend throughout society that if things are new, they are to be avoided.

What will happen is that the people who would normally upgrade will be put off by the "guru's" and then when it gets the all clear, and has become the "favourite operating system" they will need to pay to upgrade to Win 10.

I'm just saying that you might be doing a disservice to future simmers and simming in general by listening to the "conspiracy theorists" and not getting behind it.


Frank

[Bob Reed]

I sir am also in the IT game and have been for many years. I am speaking from personal experience and not hear say. Be careful about lumping all folks in the same clump!

Dear, dear, some doom and gloom here.

Having been in the IT industry in a previous life, I have heard this all before.

Win 10 is not the big boogey man that some are making out and apart from a controller issue with one Bodnar card, I've had no issues.

If the worry is about updates, then do not connect to the net. Pretty simple.
If you own a sim, your PC's from the sim probably shouldn't be connected to the net anyway.

It is just an operating system, a damn efficient one, so why would you not want to stay current and be efficient.
There seems to be a general trend throughout society that if things are new, they are to be avoided.

What will happen is that the people who would normally upgrade will be put off by the "guru's" and then when it gets the all clear, and has become the "favourite operating system" they will need to pay to upgrade to Win 10.

I'm just saying that you might be doing a disservice to future simmers and simming in general by listening to the "conspiracy theorists" and not getting behind it.


Frank

[Live2Fly]

Dear, dear, some doom and gloom here.

Having been in the IT industry in a previous life, I have heard this all before.

Win 10 is not the big boogey man that some are making out and apart from a controller issue with one Bodnar card, I've had no issues.

If the worry is about updates, then do not connect to the net. Pretty simple.
If you own a sim, your PC's from the sim probably shouldn't be connected to the net anyway.

It is just an operating system, a damn efficient one, so why would you not want to stay current and be efficient.
There seems to be a general trend throughout society that if things are new, they are to be avoided.

What will happen is that the people who would normally upgrade will be put off by the "guru's" and then when it gets the all clear, and has become the "favourite operating system" they will need to pay to upgrade to Win 10.

I'm just saying that you might be doing a disservice to future simmers and simming in general by listening to the "conspiracy theorists" and not getting behind it.


Frank

Frank, it's my opinion based on 20+ years experience in IT as an engineer to wait a little while before upgrading to the latest OS, especially Microsoft.  There's reasons why enterprises test patches and run pilot programs before deploying software. 

I never said NOT to upgrade, but if it were me, I'd wait till bugs have been worked out or they stop support for my current OS.  I apologize if I wasn't clear on that.

If you want real weather or multiplayer features, you need network access, wether it be your PC running ASN or similar.  You should be regularly updating your PCs, I can share a list of the weekly Microsoft security vulnerabilities if you would like to see why it's important to stay updated.  Malware and viruses don't just come from nefarious websites anymore. 

You are correct, it's just an operating system but its a brand new operating system...when's the last time Microsoft got something right on the first try?  What isn't efficient is troubleshooting something that worked before you upgraded.

I'm not doing a disservice to anyone.  Last time I checked the Internet is a free and open forum, I gave my opinion and shared a link, unfortunately I can't share confidential internal documents detailing other issues.  It's up to others to make up their own mind and hopefully the decision is based on more than one persons opinion...

Considering IT is my day job and has been for the past 20+ years.  I'll listen to those conspiracy theorists.  Why, because we work on this stuff everyday.  We don't have just one or two installs under our belts.  We have thousands,  and I'll take the results of 1000 installs over the results of 100 any day.

Not trying to start a fight on the Internet or compare dicks.  I just wanted to respond to each of your statements.

Hope you have a good week Frank, see you around, well online that is, lol.

[Bob Reed]

Dear, dear, some doom and gloom here.

Having been in the IT industry in a previous life, I have heard this all before.

Win 10 is not the big boogey man that some are making out and apart from a controller issue with one Bodnar card, I've had no issues.

If the worry is about updates, then do not connect to the net. Pretty simple.
If you own a sim, your PC's from the sim probably shouldn't be connected to the net anyway.

It is just an operating system, a damn efficient one, so why would you not want to stay current and be efficient.
There seems to be a general trend throughout society that if things are new, they are to be avoided.

What will happen is that the people who would normally upgrade will be put off by the "guru's" and then when it gets the all clear, and has become the "favourite operating system" they will need to pay to upgrade to Win 10.

I'm just saying that you might be doing a disservice to future simmers and simming in general by listening to the "conspiracy theorists" and not getting behind it.


Frank

Frank, it's my opinion based on 20+ years experience in IT as an engineer to wait a little while before upgrading to the latest OS, especially Microsoft.  There's reasons why enterprises test patches and run pilot programs before deploying software. 

I never said NOT to upgrade, but if it were me, I'd wait till bugs have been worked out or they stop support for my current OS.  I apologize if I wasn't clear on that.

If you want real weather or multiplayer features, you need network access, wether it be your PC running ASN or similar.  You should be regularly updating your PCs, I can share a list of the weekly Microsoft security vulnerabilities if you would like to see why it's important to stay updated.  Malware and viruses don't just come from nefarious websites anymore. 

You are correct, it's just an operating system but its a brand new operating system...when's the last time Microsoft got something right on the first try?  What isn't efficient is troubleshooting something that worked before you upgraded.

I'm not doing a disservice to anyone.  Last time I checked the Internet is a free and open forum, I gave my opinion and shared a link, unfortunately I can't share confidential internal documents detailing other issues.  It's up to others to make up their own mind and hopefully the decision is based on more than one persons opinion...

Considering IT is my day job and has been for the past 20+ years.  I'll listen to those conspiracy theorists.  Why, because we work on this stuff everyday.  We don't have just one or two installs under our belts.  We have thousands,  and I'll take the results of 1000 installs over the results of 100 any day.

Not trying to start a fight on the Internet or compare dicks.  I just wanted to respond to each of your statements.

Hope you have a good week Frank, see you around, well online that is, lol.

Agreed!!

[HarryZ]

Win 10 is not the big boogey man that some are making out and apart from a controller issue with one Bodnar card, I've had no issues.

Like I said earlier, using Win 10 on my business computer is great but....a recent security update for 10 has caused some big time issues for some programs by not allowing them to work anymore!!  Can you imagine that happening to someone's sim with all the sophisticated software that had been loaded.  One reason alone to wait for the bugs to be worked out before using 10 in your sim.

If the worry is about updates, then do not connect to the net. Pretty simple.
If you own a sim, your PC's from the sim probably shouldn't be connected to the net anyway.

Not practical at all if you use real weather programs.

There seems to be a general trend throughout society that if things are new, they are to be avoided.

Perhaps in some cases but when it comes to a sim's software, delay loading 10 is a wise decision.

I'm just saying that you might be doing a disservice to future simmers and simming in general by listening to the "conspiracy theorists" and not getting behind it.

I don't think that is what Bob said at all. He was suggesting caution with 10 and my opinion backs that line of thinking...at least for the time being.

[Aerosim Solutions]

As long as you "Keep thinging about changing" and don't actually do it, everything should run just fine!!